Convince me that the minimoog isn't the best!!

Discussions about anything analog, digital, MIDI, synth technology, techniques, theories and more.
Vertical
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 20
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 6:21 pm

Convince me that the minimoog isn't the best!!

Post by Vertical » Mon Mar 17, 2008 8:37 pm

After a lot of research and listening, and after owning a minimoog years ago, I STILL believe in my head that no other synth, including the voyager, and anything that tries to emulate the minimoog can come close in terms of fatness, thickness, warmth, and overall awesome killer sound.

Can anyone help me out of this rhut? What synth can do a silky smooth warm bass that has so much attitude and raw sound, yet is still warm and nice sounding?

Then the question is, why after so many years, why is the FIRST non-modular the one that sounds the best. Why is it that no other synth can come close to sounding like the minimoog?

Prove to me that the minimoog is not the only synth that can do a nice, fat, warm, silky smooth yet raw in your face, deep, bass sound...

User avatar
Automatic Gainsay
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 3962
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:22 am
Real name: Marc Doty
Gear: Minimoog, 2600, CS-15, CS-50, MiniBrute, MicroBrute, S2, Korg MS-20 Mini, 3 Volcas, Pro 2, Leipzig, Pianet T, Wurli 7300, Wurli 145-A, ASR-10, e6400.
Band: Godfrey's Cordial
Location: Tacoma
Contact:

Post by Automatic Gainsay » Mon Mar 17, 2008 9:14 pm

While there are a lot of great synths which each possess a great sound, there is no synth I have heard or played which really matches the Minimoog's combination of sound quality and thick warm breadth.
I have an ARP 2600 whose filter can certainly generate some really warm milky sounds (although it is the Moog ripoff filter, so that seems apt)... but it cannot match the Minimoog's all around tone/etc.
‎"I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." -Charles Babbage
"Unity and Mediocrity are forever in bed together." -Zane W.
http://www.youtube.com/automaticgainsay

User avatar
Solderman
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1799
Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2007 5:43 pm

Re: Convince me that the minimoog isn't the best!!

Post by Solderman » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:28 pm

Vertical wrote:What synth can do a silky smooth warm bass that has so much attitude and raw sound, yet is still warm and nice sounding?
System 55 Modular?
I am no longer in pursuit of vintage synths. The generally absurd inflation from demand versus practical use and maintenance costs is no longer viable. The internet has suffocated and vanquished yet another wonderful hobby. Too bad.
--Solderman no more.

User avatar
tallowwaters
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4998
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:11 am
Gear: LC-MS/MS
Location: snake's belly in a wagon rut

Post by tallowwaters » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:32 pm

Automatic Gainsay wrote: quality and thick warm bread
thats how i feel about Witte.
Brains can be used like a "stress ball," but only once.

User avatar
i_watch_stars
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 271
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 9:49 am
Location: Seattle

Post by i_watch_stars » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:49 pm

I'll take a stab at it....

I had the oppertunity to compare my SE-1 to a Model D Minimoog and I'm sorry (or happy) to say that they sounded very much alike. Due to the SE-1's nice screen, mod matrix, MIDI, and other features, I would personally rather have an SE-1 than a mini. I'm sure other people can say the same about various analogs.

Even if the mini has some unique sound, I have to say that when I tried the mini for myself, I was kind of let down. To me it just sounded like your basic analog synth...nothing really special or magical.

Anything you associate with the mini is probably just memories of certain songs by bands that used it. A lot of great bands have used it, therefore, when you play it, it sounds like something magical.
JP-8080, Virus B, TG-77, JD-990, D-550, XV-5080, CS1x, Matrix 1000, SE-1, SuperNova II Pro Rack, MKS-50, EMX-1, TX-802, Nord Rack 2X, Korg RADIAS

MrFrodo
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 952
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 9:29 pm
Real name: Eric
Location: New York, NY, USA
Contact:

Post by MrFrodo » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:53 pm

As a matter of fact, I'm developing a weird point-of-view concerning the Minimoog Model D. And, I'm not trying to make trouble, here. When I got my Voyager, I had a go at a Model D and was less than satisfied, even hearing it in the bass register. Whenever I'd read about people raving over the Model D's capabilities, I would wonder what they're so excited about. It seemed to me that the D's virtues were overstated and over-promoted. Just my opinion.

A question for everyone reading this post: have any of you ever looked at both Minimoog models and been turned off by both? Taht's starting to happen to me to a small degree.
The greatest thing we ever have is the will to survive.

Rest in peace, Dr. Robert Moog.

http://www.ericbenjamingordon.com
http://cdbaby.com/cd/ebgordon
http://www.myspace.com/ericbenjamingordon

User avatar
shaft9000
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 2042
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 3:13 am
Real name: Dave
Gear: Whips chains waxes oils dildos DMT TNT the LHC, and a black rubber duckie
Band: moneymoneymoney
Location: VanNuys, CA USA
Contact:

Post by shaft9000 » Tue Mar 18, 2008 12:13 am

MrFrodo wrote: I had a go at a Model D and was less than satisfied, even hearing it in the bass register.
i_watch_stars wrote: Even if the mini has some unique sound, I have to say that when I tried the mini for myself, I was kind of let down. To me it just sounded like your basic analog synth...nothing really special or magical.
.
Get your ears checked, fellas. The mini's oscillators alone kill the se-1, or any other mono out there for that matter short of a Moog Modular. Perhaps the Mini you played had issues or needed calibration.

to the OP:

Have you tried MacBeth? Some owners say they like them even better than Moog.
The MaxiKorg DV can give the mini a run for it's money in the girth department, as Jexus can attest. Also the Steiner-Parker Synthacon is a classic monster. I'm sure there are many others that approach it in sound and easily exceed it in functionality.
But alas, the mini reigns supreme amongst monos for the very reasons you've already stated. Something about the way it juices the circuits - power distribution (i'm no tech, obviously) throughout the signal path. It is so brash and yet so sweet when you need it to be.
I've got a Little Phatty, and it suits me fine and delivers incredible analog tone. It will sound 95% like a Mini and with some outboard I can get even closer to the brash tone of the Mini. But a Mini is a Mini, and an LP is an LP, and no amount of comparison is going to change that.
2600.solus.modcan a.eurorack.cs60.JP8.Juno6.A6.sunsyn.volcakeys.jd990.tb303.x0xb0x.revolution.
999.m1am1.RY30.svc350.memotron

shaft9000.muffwiggler.com <- singles & mixtape
shaft9000.bandcamp.com <- spacemusic album
youtube.com/shaft9000 <- various synth demos and studies

User avatar
OriginalJambo
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 2560
Joined: Sun Jul 09, 2006 12:04 am
Gear: Check my sig
Location: Scotland, United Kingdom

Post by OriginalJambo » Tue Mar 18, 2008 1:09 am

The LP might not sound like a Mini (I've never played a Mini) but it sounds like a Moog and that's good enough for me. ;) And I'm sure many of the other Moog synths can sound quite similar to a Mini at times.

User avatar
hfinn
Expert Member
Expert Member
Posts: 1197
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 3:21 pm
Gear: http://soundcloud.com/heath-finnie
Location: Boston
Contact:

Post by hfinn » Tue Mar 18, 2008 1:14 am

The Minimoog is the best.

gfriden
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 312
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 12:02 am
Location: Sweden

Re: Convince me that the minimoog isn't the best!!

Post by gfriden » Tue Mar 18, 2008 2:26 am

Vertical wrote:... no other synth, including the voyager, and anything that tries to emulate the minimoog can come close in terms of fatness, thickness, warmth...
Then the question is, why after so many years, why is the FIRST non-modular the one that sounds the best. Why is it that no other synth can come close to sounding like the minimoog?
Why? Because the sounds you are after were defined by that synth. That's the benefit of being first. Add some other criteria that that synth does not fulfill, and it will fall short of the mark. Besides, why would other manufacturers want to make synths that sound like the mini, when the mini is allready there to do the job? Furthermore, Moog threatened to take legal action when ARP came up with that ladder filter that came too close to the Moog original. So patents probably played a role too. Sorry, hate to be a party pooper... :oops:
Art is not a copy of the real world. One of the damn things is enough.

User avatar
Neonlights84
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 391
Joined: Tue Jul 04, 2006 5:28 am
Gear: Moog Minimoog Model D
Behringer DeepMind12
Novation UltraNova
Korg MS20 mini
Korg EMX-1
Band: Winter's Glow
Contact:

Post by Neonlights84 » Tue Mar 18, 2008 3:05 am

OriginalJambo wrote:The LP might not sound like a Mini (I've never played a Mini) but it sounds like a Moog and that's good enough for me. ;) And I'm sure many of the other Moog synths can sound quite similar to a Mini at times.

Yea...its just one of those things.,..a mini is a mini is a mini. That being said, my LP has midi and memory and is a lot stable at half the cost...so you can go ahead and have your minimoog. :evil: Haha
Gear: Novation Ultranova, Korg Monotribe, Korg Electribe EMX-1, Electro-Harmonix Memory Boy, Lexicon MX200.

User avatar
CZ Rider
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 265
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2007 12:31 am
Location: The Edge of Space
Contact:

Post by CZ Rider » Tue Mar 18, 2008 4:11 am

Like searching for the Holy Grail of Moog sounding mono synths?
Something that can get the sounds of the Mini, but has that extra mean and nasty edge that takes the Moog sound to the next level? A Minimoog on steroids?
I have had a Mini since 1974, and never have I been without one, even through the dark digital ages of the 80's. And I never played any synthesizer that could stir my soul like a Minimoog does, untill I got my hands on a Moog Model 1P. Damn, this thing can get the meanest sounds, and unbelievable bass. Sure, it has the 904A low pass filter that many have copied, but there is magic in the other parts that are sometimes overlooked. The CP-3 mixers are responsible for much of the nasty level. These mixers are setup so with the master gain at 10, the four inputs set at 5 will give unity gain. At 5 or 6 it gets that Mini overdrtive sound, krank em to 10 and you get almost a ring mod type overdrive. Now feedback the filter back into the mixer, or invert some of the oscillators through the other mixer, or through the FFB back into the first mixer. You get the idea, a large pallet of sound possibilities just using different mixer routings.
The Moog 1P is often overshadowed by the bigger 10 oscillator 3P. But if you look close at the 1P system, it is very similar to the Mini. It has 3 oscillators, one and two locked together, with the third that can be seperated to use as a modulator, just as on the Mini. Two EG's, a low pass filter, mixer, noise source, performance routing switches, plus the extras, FFB, reverb, and 960 sequencer. It is as if they used this configuration to model the Mini after. Add in some of the Moog accessories like the ribbon, drum controller, or the Taurus 2 pedals for a very versatile synthesizer system where the configurations are as limited as your imagination.
The Moog 1P is a Minimoog on steroids! (With the T2 pedals, this will challange the original Taurus bass sound!)
Image
Sound of a Moog 1P!

User avatar
i_watch_stars
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 271
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 9:49 am
Location: Seattle

Post by i_watch_stars » Tue Mar 18, 2008 4:55 am

shaft9000 wrote:
Get your ears checked, fellas. The mini's oscillators alone kill the se-1, or any other mono out there
So a mini's saw wave "kills" every other synths' saw wave...right..... :roll: A little extreme wouldn't you say?

You, nor anyone else couldn't tell a mini apart from some other analog in the mix, or probably even alone for that matter.
JP-8080, Virus B, TG-77, JD-990, D-550, XV-5080, CS1x, Matrix 1000, SE-1, SuperNova II Pro Rack, MKS-50, EMX-1, TX-802, Nord Rack 2X, Korg RADIAS

User avatar
Cycom
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 58
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:07 am
Gear: Mac Pro
T.C. Electronic Konnekt 24D
ADAM A7
SCI Prophet VS
Roland Super JX
Logic 8
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Post by Cycom » Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:42 am

i_watch_stars wrote:
shaft9000 wrote:
Get your ears checked, fellas. The mini's oscillators alone kill the se-1, or any other mono out there
So a mini's saw wave "kills" every other synths' saw wave...right..... :roll: A little extreme wouldn't you say?

You, nor anyone else couldn't tell a mini apart from some other analog in the mix, or probably even alone for that matter.
Pretty much what I was thinking. I find people who have a "this synth is BETTER than that synth.....it sounds fatter! It's the best evah!!!LOLZZZ!!!!!" mentality to be utterly ridiculous. Way to appear like foaming-at-the-mouth mongoloids.

Guess what: I think the CS-80 is a huge, monster-sounding poly with a tone all of its own.....but to say one can't get close to its sound with other analog poly's is absurd....especially in today's digital DAW mixing environment. Much less me saying that the CS-80 is better than another synth. How would I prove that it's any more special than a Matrix 12 or even my JX-10? These things are almost always subjective.
"We try to encode the world, decoded and recorded on our machines." -Clock DVA

maindeglorie
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 614
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2006 3:17 am
Gear: Voyager Select,Little Phatty,ARP Solus,Omni II,Yamaha CS-40M,Prophet 5,Prophet 08,OB-Xa,MaxiKorg,Nord Lead 3,Nord Wave,Eurorack modular, etc.
Location: Pennsylvania (NEPA)

Post by maindeglorie » Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:47 am

I really don't think that the mini kills the Voyager at all. I think they're REALLY close, and the Voyager has the upper hand in my opinion. You know what's really awesome though... the mini sounds fantastic, the Voyager sounds wonderful, the SE-1x is a killer, the Yamaha CS (especially the M's) rip walls, the SH-5 is a sonic explosion. All these synths sound great. It's a matter of which one does it for you. Some synths work for some people, while others work for other people. They are all fantastic instruments, and none of them are better than the other in reality. That part is completely up to the user.

Post Reply