Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

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StepLogik
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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by StepLogik » Sat Jan 15, 2011 5:24 pm

With the release of the Korg Kronos and its apparent devolution from the M3 Expanded sequencer, I thought it might be interesting to see what people thought of the M3 Expanded sequencer or if anyone was actually using it.

I didn't even know that Korg had updated the sequencer software with the Expanded package, but apparently new track edit and piano roll functions were added. Anyone used them? How are they?

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by Plumpudding » Sat Jan 15, 2011 6:49 pm

I'm not sure if it really counts, but I'd have to say the record/play fuction on my Yamaha PSR-7. You can't program it, only play live, Plays back a sequence once (you have to press play over and over to trigger), with added disco beat if you forget to mute accompany volume, no polyphony, no velocity, and for some reason it changes the preset a little. Utterly useless function. All in all the keyboard is c**p, and a lot of cheap fun. I use it in almost everything I do.
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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by goom » Sun Jan 16, 2011 3:24 am

I agree - the Yamaha QX21 and QX7 were the worst!

http://www.i2.i-2000.com/~jeffrey/QX7.htm

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by elphcoil » Sun Jan 16, 2011 3:39 am

i'm glad to see the brother pdc100 made the list earlier. that was my first sequencer and i was barely able to write more than a couple of songs with it. that thing was utter c**p. despite that, i still kept an interest in music and eventually upgraded.

i'm surprised the yamaha/microsoft cx5m hasn't been mentioned. in theory it was a cool concept for the time but it failed on execution. clunky and obtuse.

i don't have the hate for the mc-202 sequencer. i kind of like it for small 1-4 bar loops but i'd never write an entire track start to finish with its sequencer. the cpu lag on the cv inputs is a real drag. i need to mod that.
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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by StepLogik » Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:23 pm

i might have to add the korg microstation's sequencer to the "worst" list. i was expecting something akin to an MMT-8 but its nothing like it. its basically a linear sequencer with some nice looping facilities. but the killer is that the menu tree for the sequencer functions is massive. it takes 5000 button pushes to, say, copy a measure from one part to another. also, you absolutely must have pencil and paper so you can write down measure numbers for all your parts (verses, chorus, bridge, etc) otherwise its easy to get lost.

awesome, fun synth but the sequencer is a headache. i've actually been pairing it up with the yamaha qy-100 (far superior sequencer) and the two make a very powerful and portable combination.

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by mute » Tue Mar 22, 2011 12:48 pm

Why no one has cloned the JX-3P polyphonic step sequencer and elaborated upon it.. I have no idea. That thing is golden.

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by StepLogik » Wed Mar 23, 2011 2:42 pm

mute wrote:Why no one has cloned the JX-3P polyphonic step sequencer and elaborated upon it.. I have no idea. That thing is golden.
What is so special about it? I've never used it before. Is it similar to the polyphonic 1-track step sequencer in the Poly-800?

A lot of the modern step sequencers (Genoqs, etc) are polyphonic.

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by Phollop Willing PA » Wed Mar 23, 2011 6:19 pm

goom wrote:I agree - the Yamaha QX21 and QX7 were the worst!

http://www.i2.i-2000.com/~jeffrey/QX7.htm
I'm still using the QX7 as a sketch idea sequencer. I like the big red numbers that I can see across the room and probably since I've been using it since they were first made, have gotten quite instinctive with it. It was my first MIDI sequencer.

Right now, it records step notes and appegiations for the MacBeth M5 while I'm waiting for a DARK TIME, maybe.

I did try that grey Alessis thingie, MMT8 or something, and couldn't deal with it.

I'm currently using a Roland MC50 for a general sequencer.

My first sequencer was one of those digital Roland ones that had CV and gates. That was sort of okay but used to have crappy behaviours just when I need it. I had it linked to an ARP 2600.
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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by Virgule » Wed Mar 23, 2011 10:29 pm

I thought the QX21 was a solid little piece that was easy to use, beeps and all.
The MMT-8 was a frustrating experience and having to boot the MC500 everytime before usage was a pain.

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by mute » Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:36 am

StepLogik wrote:
mute wrote:Why no one has cloned the JX-3P polyphonic step sequencer and elaborated upon it.. I have no idea. That thing is golden.
What is so special about it? I've never used it before. Is it similar to the polyphonic 1-track step sequencer in the Poly-800?

A lot of the modern step sequencers (Genoqs, etc) are polyphonic.
It's a simple step write sequencer with a 16 step indicator and simple editing. Think electribe but polyphonic with kb input. It also supports global transpose from the kb, which is cooler than it sounds. It's similar to the Poly 800's, but the poly800 has no tactile control or visual feedback and editing isn't nearly as quick. Thats the whole point/appeal of the JX3P sequencer.. its a real 16 step entry, 1-track, sequencer. Any other poly-step sequencer is either too deep, doesnt take the 16step approach, or are way too expensive and way too feature laden. The step sequencer, and abuse of it, is one of the things that seperates the 3P from its brethren...sonically and functionally. You can for sure pull off some of the same tricks with the Poly 800 though.

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by Ashe37 » Thu Mar 24, 2011 6:42 am

StepLogik wrote:With the release of the Korg Kronos and its apparent devolution from the M3 Expanded sequencer, I thought it might be interesting to see what people thought of the M3 Expanded sequencer or if anyone was actually using it.

I didn't even know that Korg had updated the sequencer software with the Expanded package, but apparently new track edit and piano roll functions were added. Anyone used them? How are they?
It works, its not easy to use on the tiny screen. Like many others, for stuff like that i use a nintendo DS stylus instead of a fingertip when using the sequencer.

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by StepLogik » Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:38 pm

Ashe37 wrote:
StepLogik wrote:With the release of the Korg Kronos and its apparent devolution from the M3 Expanded sequencer, I thought it might be interesting to see what people thought of the M3 Expanded sequencer or if anyone was actually using it.

I didn't even know that Korg had updated the sequencer software with the Expanded package, but apparently new track edit and piano roll functions were added. Anyone used them? How are they?
It works, its not easy to use on the tiny screen. Like many others, for stuff like that i use a nintendo DS stylus instead of a fingertip when using the sequencer.
the M3 has an approx 5 1/2" screen and the Kronos has an 8". if they do include all the Expanded sequencer features the extra screen real estate will be welcome.

the fantom-g has an 8.5" screen but its not a touchscreen and the mouse doesn't work (much) on the sequencer screens or the piano roll editor.

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by Ashe37 » Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:05 am

StepLogik wrote: the M3 has an approx 5 1/2" screen and the Kronos has an 8". if they do include all the Expanded sequencer features the extra screen real estate will be welcome.

the fantom-g has an 8.5" screen but its not a touchscreen and the mouse doesn't work (much) on the sequencer screens or the piano roll editor.
The problem with using the editor on the M3 is part size and part resolution, the Kronos would solve both- but apparently it does not have the piano roll,

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by StepLogik » Fri Mar 25, 2011 4:14 pm

Ashe37 wrote:
StepLogik wrote: the M3 has an approx 5 1/2" screen and the Kronos has an 8". if they do include all the Expanded sequencer features the extra screen real estate will be welcome.

the fantom-g has an 8.5" screen but its not a touchscreen and the mouse doesn't work (much) on the sequencer screens or the piano roll editor.
The problem with using the editor on the M3 is part size and part resolution, the Kronos would solve both- but apparently it does not have the piano roll,
that will be a shame :( perhaps korg will implement that feature in an upcoming software update. i suppose at this point they are just trying to get the thing out the door with the core feature set.

it does make me wonder about the "loss of features" in a company's product line. when a product "de-evolves" a feature, especially a software one, you have to wonder what kind of software engineering practices they are using. if done properly, their piano roll code should be modularized (really, the whole sequencer) and able to be dropped into any product. obviously, there are mitigating factors (CPU speed, amount of program ROM available, hardware factors like display resolution and buttons, etc) but the general concept is pretty basic software engineering 101. my guess is that the logic is there they just don't have the front-end UI work done yet.

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Re: Worst.. hardware sequencer.. EVER

Post by krzeppa » Sat Mar 26, 2011 3:23 pm

I hated the sequencer on my orignal Roland Fantom FA-76. A simple task would take 10-15x longer to complete on it. Absolutley aweful!

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