Have presets killed control once more?

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Have presets killed control once more?

Post by 23 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:31 am

With things like the Mopho, TI Snow, Blowfeld, etc. rolling out...
things with extremely limited control sets in regard to the overall architectural depth (this is not to neglect mention of a number of MIDI controllers that seem to roll in fairly similar strains)...
Is it just me or is control being lost once more?

Not to the degree seen during during the late 80s through mid 90s period
but perhaps to a degree that would take a second place to that.

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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by wiss » Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:39 am

if the song is good, does it really matter?

I think most of these come with software editors, so one could dig deeper into them.

I am not paying attention to them, there cool boxes with instant gratification for the budget minded.
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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by griffin avid » Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:00 am

things with extremely limited control sets in regard to the overall architectural depth

If you wanted that much control, wouldn't you buy the full keyboard synth? And shouldn't you be speaking about the knobbage on the Prophet 08 and Access TI and Waldorf Stromberg?
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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by 23 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:05 am

wiss wrote:if the song is good, does it really matter?

I think most of these come with software editors, so one could dig deeper into them.

I am not paying attention to them, there cool boxes with instant gratification for the budget minded.
I think the control method to a large degree can determine the resulting sound of an instrument, and in that fashion, I think there is something more than mere programming ease.
I think this can most blatantly be shown with things like C-Sound in contrast to say a Pro-1.
It's not that C-Sound can't achieve close emulations of the same sounds as the Pro-1, but due to the drastic change in control method, the resulting sounds one gets from either are likely to be drastically different.

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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by 23 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:16 am

griffin avid wrote:things with extremely limited control sets in regard to the overall architectural depth

If you wanted that much control, wouldn't you buy the full keyboard synth? And shouldn't you be speaking about the knobbage on the Prophet 08 and Access TI and Waldorf Stromberg?
The Virus series (IMO) has always come up relatively short in regard to how much control it offered in relation to it's overall architecture no matter which way it was approached.
(granted I think even Access realized this and sought for the VSTi editor to ease a lot of this)

Point heard on the Stromberg and to a lesser degree the P-08 (can't say I feel a mono-version has to have such a drastic cut in it's UI).

Whatever the case, I'm getting the feeling I'm more of a loner in regard to feeling that some of the more recent products are more (or too) constricting.

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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by wiss » Thu Jan 08, 2009 10:08 am

If you feel there is a general lack of control with modern synths, design your own.


If you can hold your own, you should be able to get a decent sound out of any synth. There is no excuse what so ever.
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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by 23 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 10:20 am

wiss wrote:If you feel there is a general lack of control with modern synths, design your own.
I'm not overly concerned really, it was more just a general observation.
Do I find some of the newer designs to be restrictive?
Sure, but then again as a noted earlier, there was a substantive period in the past where control got dropped significantly.

The basic thing I seem to be hearing (thus far) is "Sure, there's less control, but the cost gets dropped and you can just use software if you have an interest in deeper programming".

I wasn't saying there was anything wrong with the cut backs on controls (granted they aren't appealing to me), but I was wondering if
A. Was alone in noticing a trend towards such
B. How people felt about such a trend (if it exist)

*for note, as I noted in the C-Sound example, I merely noted that changes in control method are likely to change approach. I did not at all state that drops in physical controls meant drops in overall timbral capability; in fact I meant to STRONGLY point to the fact that drops in physical controls need not mean such....hence why I used C-Sound as an example [comparing it to the FAR MORE timbrally limited Pro-1].*

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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by griffin avid » Thu Jan 08, 2009 12:17 pm

I agree that he physical interface and layout and...well chain of menus DO lead to programming tendencies. I see it as the logic of the GUI designer...they have a method/order they think you will want to work in.

I don't see a trend through...it'd have to be a sweeping change.
If anything I'd say maybe the opposite. Even synths and workstations seem to be adding extra contol features and interface doo-dads...

The Voyager has the three-dimensional touch surface.
The Korg M3 XY mode and touchscreen...
Roland and their D-Beams... V-Synth...Yamaha and their sliders and mini touch ribbons...
Fantom G with the huge screen
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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by meatballfulton » Thu Jan 08, 2009 2:05 pm

23 wrote:Is it just me or is control being lost once more?.
It's just $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

Knobs and switches cost a lot of money relative to the rest of a synth and manufacturers have found that 4 knobs is satisfactory for most users.
I listened to Hatfield and the North at Rainbow. They were very wonderful and they made my heart a prisoner.

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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by cornutt » Thu Jan 08, 2009 4:11 pm

griffin avid wrote:Waldorf Stromberg?
The Stromborg? Did it get released and did I not hear about it??? Or did you mean the Blofeld?
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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by griffin avid » Thu Jan 08, 2009 4:26 pm

It's coming....someone on another forum posted this image..


Image
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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by Blue Monster 65 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 4:36 pm

Oh my ... I do like the looks of that!

Now does it come in shades of blue ...

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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by Joey » Thu Jan 08, 2009 5:14 pm

thats the same image of the stromberg that has been floating around for ages

its just a plastic model with lights in it, hence why its in a glass case

stromberg is still very conceptual, I don't think waldorf has enough money to produce it

h**l they had to raise the price on the blofeld
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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by griffin avid » Thu Jan 08, 2009 5:37 pm

its just a plastic model with lights in it

Are you serious?!!!!!!
Why would they...how could they....my heart is broken.
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Re: Have presets killed control once more?

Post by ronP » Thu Jan 08, 2009 5:47 pm

oo


True observation that the window of knob-per-function appears to be closing again.

To wit: I love my microKorg for its dimensions, but would love to have an MS2000 and its knobs for live tweaking, which is a hassle at best when working with a matrix format. I plan eventually to acquire a DSI Evolver, but I am going for the much more expensive MEK rather than the module for the same reason; I want the Evolver sound, but the Evolver sans keyboard is a matrix, whilst the MEK is 58 knobs of grabbable goodness.

There is the ROLAND SH-201 at least . . . this design direction I would prefer: more controls, fewer screens!

:)


oo
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