Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Discussions about anything analog, digital, MIDI, synth technology, techniques, theories and more.
maindeglorie
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 613
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2006 3:17 am
Gear: Voyager Select,Little Phatty,ARP Solus,Omni II,Yamaha CS-40M,Prophet 5,Prophet 08,OB-Xa,MaxiKorg,Nord Lead 3,Nord Wave,Eurorack modular, etc.
Location: Pennsylvania (NEPA)

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by maindeglorie » Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:02 am

Does anybody else have a problem with their P08 clipping very easy? If I make an even slightly aggressive patch, I get a lot of clipping and distortion. I knew there was some in the P08, but it's present in mine so much, that I'm starting to wonder if something is not right. It's really annoying.

User avatar
Stab Frenzy
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9723
Joined: Tue Jun 06, 2006 5:41 pm
Gear: Eurorack, RYTM, Ultranova, many FX
Location: monster island*
Contact:

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by Stab Frenzy » Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:07 am

What level are the oscs set to? DSI designs synths so you can overdrive them if you want, so if you have the osc level set to over 60 or so and have a lot of Env and Velocity sent to the VCA then you'll get clipping. To get rid of it turn one or more of these things down. :thumbright:

mute
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 640
Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 6:51 pm

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by mute » Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:44 am

PEK's aren't going for under 1k, check any of those auctions before they end (or completed listings) and they'll average up around 1250-1500, used. The new ones are still +/- 2000 usd. Fact of the matter is, like the Prophet 08, most of the offical retailers for the DSI stuff sell largely through Ebay so there's always a ton listed and they aren't always bought.. then relisted. That makes it look like some of the prices are low and I think some people stupidly base their selling price around that. MEK's however.. I've seen go for like 900. The Evolver desktop still averages 500$'s used, but occassionally you'll see someone drop one for 400-450. There's one on Ebay right now used for 400$'s Buy It Now.. that's a crazy deal. I got mine for 450 with a gator case and felt like i ripped someone off :)

mute
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 640
Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 6:51 pm

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by mute » Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:48 am

Stab Frenzy wrote:What level are the oscs set to? DSI designs synths so you can overdrive them if you want, so if you have the osc level set to over 60 or so and have a lot of Env and Velocity sent to the VCA then you'll get clipping. To get rid of it turn one or more of these things down. :thumbright:
you forgot to mention the Feedback Level amount. Even if you have Feedback set to Off, the FB Level still acts as another gain. this is often my source when I'm accidentally clipping a patch and i usually check it first :)

edit: n/m you were talking about the prophet

User avatar
Stab Frenzy
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9723
Joined: Tue Jun 06, 2006 5:41 pm
Gear: Eurorack, RYTM, Ultranova, many FX
Location: monster island*
Contact:

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by Stab Frenzy » Thu Jul 09, 2009 5:26 am

mute wrote:you forgot to mention the Feedback Level amount. Even if you have Feedback set to Off, the FB Level still acts as another gain. this is often my source when I'm accidentally clipping a patch and i usually check it first :)
That's not how the feedback on the Evolver works, the only way to turn it off is to set the feedback level to 0. It never acts as clean gain, if the frequency is set to 0 and the level is turned up then you're getting feedback, but but the frequency is very low so you might not hear it as a typical feedback sound. If the grunge parameter is switched off and the level is above 0 you're still getting feedback, it's just not getting messed up as much. I'm guessing when you said 'Feedback set to Off' you were talking about Grunge, not feedback.

User avatar
Joey
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 1885
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 10:13 pm
Gear: 18u Eurorack, Octatrack, Pro2
Band: BLUSH_RESPONSE
Location: Berlin
Contact:

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by Joey » Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:37 pm

f**k I need an evolver.
No one cares, no one sympathizes,
so you just stay home and play synthesizers.

http://wearereplicants.com

User avatar
Yatmandu
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 168
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 6:57 pm
Gear: reverse
Location: Oith

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by Yatmandu » Thu Jul 09, 2009 5:23 pm

Even the one that looked like a firesale, from Saint-Sauveur, Quebec, ended up fetching US$1295, which is still a good price for the PEK. I'd be surprised to see them go for much less than that, DCO click notwithstanding :)

http://cgi.ebay.com/Dave-Smith-Instrume ... RCH:US:101

User avatar
xpander
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 1541
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2007 7:15 am
Gear: UltraProteus, Xpander, 200e, Minimoogs, Radias, Prophet VS, PolyEvolver, Arp 2600
Location: los gatos, california
Contact:

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by xpander » Thu Jul 09, 2009 6:45 pm

shoulda remade the CEM3374s...

User avatar
Jabberwalky
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 2134
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 6:03 pm
Gear: A hybrid of vintage and modern junk
Band: Variar
Location: Pgh, PA
Contact:

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by Jabberwalky » Thu Jul 09, 2009 7:59 pm

What synth used those? It's strange how the Evolver uses a modified 3396, but it sounds nothing like a Matrix 6

User avatar
Jinsai
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 131
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:07 am
Gear: Alesis Ion
JX-3P w/Kiwitechnics
Nord Lead 2
Poly Evolver Keyboard
Prophet 12
Tempest
Assorted basses, guitars, software
Band: Sid Luscious and The Pants
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by Jinsai » Fri Jul 10, 2009 2:27 am

This is both hilarious and disappointing.

Hilarious because I've owned an Evolver of one sort or another for 4 years or so and never noticed this until I read this post. So I got home today, dialed up a patch, and now I can't stop hearing it! :(

Play a bunch of low notes, then play some higher notes (up 2 octaves or so) you get this sort of low-frequency "clop" at the beginning of the higher frequency notes.

It only happens as each voice transitions from a lower note to a higher note. In the other direction, it's not as audible or as severe a problem.

More "character", for sure. But not exactly fun or musical.
--
"A musician is someone who's heard a lot of music" - Pierre Boulez

User avatar
madtheory
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 5136
Joined: Mon May 01, 2006 12:45 pm
Real name: Tomas Mulcahy
Gear: Flangebeast Mk1, Plonkotron, Morovdis Arpeggiator, Maplin My First EQ, Cabaret Voltaire, Jeff Wayne Thunderchild rack, thermostat, Buck Owens Moog.
Band: Minim
Location: Cork, Ireland
Contact:

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by madtheory » Fri Jul 10, 2009 12:34 pm

Jabberwalky wrote:What synth used those? It's strange how the Evolver uses a modified 3396, but it sounds nothing like a Matrix 6
Not strange at all. It's the designer that determines the sound. When it's someone like Dave Smith, your dealing with a genius, by far the dominant component in the equation :)

masstronaut
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 756
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:26 pm

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by masstronaut » Fri Jul 10, 2009 1:18 pm

madtheory wrote:
Jabberwalky wrote:What synth used those? It's strange how the Evolver uses a modified 3396, but it sounds nothing like a Matrix 6
Not strange at all. It's the designer that determines the sound. When it's someone like Dave Smith, your dealing with a genius, by far the dominant component in the equation :)
Well it's what the designer does that's important isn't it? Unless you are arguing for something more mysterious.

mute
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 640
Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 6:51 pm

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by mute » Fri Jul 10, 2009 3:00 pm

Stab Frenzy wrote:
mute wrote:you forgot to mention the Feedback Level amount. Even if you have Feedback set to Off, the FB Level still acts as another gain. this is often my source when I'm accidentally clipping a patch and i usually check it first :)
That's not how the feedback on the Evolver works, the only way to turn it off is to set the feedback level to 0. It never acts as clean gain, if the frequency is set to 0 and the level is turned up then you're getting feedback, but but the frequency is very low so you might not hear it as a typical feedback sound. If the grunge parameter is switched off and the level is above 0 you're still getting feedback, it's just not getting messed up as much. I'm guessing when you said 'Feedback set to Off' you were talking about Grunge, not feedback.
No, that's exactly what I meant & how it works.. it just came out wrong. This has come up in several topics about the evolver on multiple forums. Alot of people think they have the feedback turned off if the frequency param is set to 0. It's not, you have to turn the level all the way down.

User avatar
madtheory
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 5136
Joined: Mon May 01, 2006 12:45 pm
Real name: Tomas Mulcahy
Gear: Flangebeast Mk1, Plonkotron, Morovdis Arpeggiator, Maplin My First EQ, Cabaret Voltaire, Jeff Wayne Thunderchild rack, thermostat, Buck Owens Moog.
Band: Minim
Location: Cork, Ireland
Contact:

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by madtheory » Fri Jul 10, 2009 3:21 pm

masstronaut wrote:
madtheory wrote:
Jabberwalky wrote:What synth used those? It's strange how the Evolver uses a modified 3396, but it sounds nothing like a Matrix 6
Not strange at all. It's the designer that determines the sound. When it's someone like Dave Smith, your dealing with a genius, by far the dominant component in the equation :)
Well it's what the designer does that's important isn't it? Unless you are arguing for something more mysterious.
The designer designs, that's my point. So yes, it's the "does" :). To clarify- it is him/ her that is by far the biggest determinant of the instrument, not the component parts. It's a synergy.

There's a tendency for people to reduce a synth to it's component parts, ignoring how it all comes together. Reductionism can only get you so far. Illogical syllogisms creep in too. For example "CEM 3324s are great filters, therefore all synths that use them are great".

User avatar
Stab Frenzy
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9723
Joined: Tue Jun 06, 2006 5:41 pm
Gear: Eurorack, RYTM, Ultranova, many FX
Location: monster island*
Contact:

Re: Technical discussion of DSI synths and their DCO pop

Post by Stab Frenzy » Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:16 pm

mute wrote:No, that's exactly what I meant & how it works.. it just came out wrong. This has come up in several topics about the evolver on multiple forums. Alot of people think they have the feedback turned off if the frequency param is set to 0. It's not, you have to turn the level all the way down.
Sorry, it sounded like you were one of those people too. :)

Post Reply