Digital V.A.S.T

Discussions about anything analog, digital, MIDI, synth technology, techniques, theories and more.
shadyjake
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:36 am

Digital V.A.S.T

Post by shadyjake » Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:07 am

Can someone tell me EXACTLY what "Digital V.A.S.T" is? i almost got a Kurzweil • K2000 on ebay but got outbidded....someone just went above my limit, but it went for 265...it was slightly beat up tho...anyway, what are other synths i can get that have Digital V.A.S.T ?

User avatar
masyst
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 141
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2006 3:20 pm
Gear: 5 gears + reverse
Location: Oslo, Norway

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by masyst » Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:28 am

Well, VAST stands for Variable Architecture Synthesis Technology and is a technology made by Kurzweil, wich means that only Kurzweil synths will have VAST.
VAST allows you to take any multi-sample, noise or waveform and process it using just about any synthesis technique.
You can find VAST in Kurzweil K2000, K2500 and K2600 as well as in Kurzweil's newer synths.
A synthesizer will be for you what you want it to be...

User avatar
Christopher Winkels
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 690
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 12:52 am
Location: Burlington, Canada, eh.

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by Christopher Winkels » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:52 pm

Worth mentioning too is that since VAST was an exclusively Kurzweil implementation, and since all Kurzweil synths have been digital, calling it "digital VAST" is a bit of a tautology.

(Removes AG hat) :wink:

User avatar
seamonkey
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2007 6:09 pm
Real name: Rick
Location: Sunny Florida

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by seamonkey » Sun Aug 16, 2009 12:59 pm

why were you bidding on something you didn't know what it was?
what made you choose the Kurzweil?
It's always good to do as much research as possible before deciding to purchase used or new equipment, a simple search on VAST would have given you a plethora of information.

Don't mean to sound hard on you but I don't understand what you were thinking, you are asking what other synths have VAST when you don't even know what VAST is.
Moog Voyager Roland D50 Ensoniq VFX-SD, Korg Wavestation Emulator II, Emax SE Plus, Korg King Korg, Korg Arp Odyssey(Whiteface), Minibrute, Takamine Acoustic Peavey Falcon electric

shadyjake
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:36 am

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by shadyjake » Sun Aug 16, 2009 1:14 pm

i have an idea of what it is... i know that it allows you to take any multi-sample, noise or waveform and process it using just about any synthesis technique. . . . but i wanted to know what kind of sound it can create, and i wasnt gonna bid over 100$, which would be a h**l of a bargain if i do get it

User avatar
meatballfulton
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 5982
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2005 9:29 pm
Gear: Logic Pro X

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by meatballfulton » Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:39 pm

Sign me up for a $100 K2000 :shock:
I listened to Hatfield and the North at Rainbow. They were very wonderful and they made my heart a prisoner.

Virgule
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 377
Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2009 8:46 pm

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by Virgule » Mon Aug 17, 2009 12:09 am

:)
Last edited by Virgule on Mon Oct 12, 2009 4:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
matia
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 346
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 12:02 am
Real name: matia
Gear: Forum said that I exceeded 150 characters. Here's a partial:
Serge Modular 9 pannels SMS Modular almost all modules
ARP 2600
Roland Tr 808 ....
Location: SF Bay Area
Contact:

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by matia » Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:25 am

i have a K2000 with sampling, a brand new screen, maxed ram, latest OS and a scsi zip that i'll sell for $250. I have photo's as well. There is only a cosmetic flaw which is a crack in the casing on the far right side but it really isn't a big deal. I did all the upgrades myself and it works flawlessly.

-matia

JB
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 56
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 3:48 pm
Gear: K2500RS + KDFX, K2600R, 2 x DMTi, KSP8, Capybara 320, DSI Mono Evolver Kbd, DeepBase9, Powercore Firewire + Virus, Yamaha TX81z & 03d
Location: Norwich, UK

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by JB » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:00 am

For an overview of VAST download the Reference guide and Performance guides from here:

http://www.kurzweilmusicsystems.com/Pro ... =downloads

Performance guide chapter 7 explains the Program mode where VAST is implemented.

Reference guide chapter 7 shows the algorythms used to give you an idea of how flexible the VAST architecture is (and it's restrictions).

goldphinga
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 67
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 10:15 am

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by goldphinga » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:13 am

VAST is so vast, its a nightmare to program and one of the most hands off interfaces every. Recently tried a kurz pc361 and it made amazing sounds but getting there was a battle.
htttp://www.myspace.com/jazzdoctor73
htttp://www.jd73.co.uk

LP/Voyager/Source/Moogerfoogers/NordStage/Logan SM2/Solina/Memorymoogplus/MicroKorg/B3+122RV/ClavD6/Rhodes Suitcase73x2/EmuE4K/YamahaEx5/Dx100

JB
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 56
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 3:48 pm
Gear: K2500RS + KDFX, K2600R, 2 x DMTi, KSP8, Capybara 320, DSI Mono Evolver Kbd, DeepBase9, Powercore Firewire + Virus, Yamaha TX81z & 03d
Location: Norwich, UK

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by JB » Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:12 pm

Haven't tried a PC3 yet but programming on a K2000/2500 is fairly quick, of course familiarity leads to speed so trying it for the first time can be confusing....

I remember testing a K2500 when it was first released in '96 and embarassingly needing to ask the store assistant for the manuals before being able to figure out how to change the filter cut-off freq (as the program that I was editing didn't have a filter in the algorythm by default).

As soon as you figure out the fundamentals:

Normal subtractive synth:
Osc/ROM/RAM > Filter(s) > Amp

VAST:
Osc/ROM/RAM > Algorythm > Amp

...where the algorythm is made up of three changable DSP "blocks" with varying interconnections it all makes sense.

You then select the appropriate algorythm that has the specific functions/routing options for the kind of sound that you want to program e.g. if you want your sampled snare drum to pass through a twin peak band-pass filter then you need to select algorythm 1 as this is the only algorythm that offers this function, alternatively if you want to pass a ROM sawtooth wave through a 2 pole low-pass filter with resonance and through distortion but in *parallel* then select algorythm 7, if you then decide that you actually wanted the Filter and Distortion blocks to be in a series configuration change from algorythm 7 to algorythm 4. (this will make sense if looking at chapter 7 in the reference manual).

Now then, triple mode in the K2600 v2, that can get confusing!

User avatar
balma
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 2851
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2008 3:52 pm
Real name: Mauricio
Gear: DSI Tempest/Prophet 08/Roland V-Synth/Ensoniq Fizmo/E-mu MP7-XL7/Electribe ESX1/Radias/Waldorf MicroQ
Location: Costa Rica

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by balma » Mon Aug 17, 2009 10:58 pm

Well, that's a pretty good explanation


if you have an idea of what Variphrase for Roland is.....

VAST is just the name for Kurzweil's software to manipulate samples or their synthesis .... well that's my idea, I had kurzweil in the past and I simple will love to have another one, but I want a K2600 and they are expensive

what is most important here is:

Kurzweil are high quality instruments. If you can get one for a reasonable price do not hesitate. This synths are great for acoustic instruments, they take a lot care on sound quality of strings, pianos. Special for keyboard
performance and being expressive.
You can see on VH1 lots of virtuous keyboard players using kurzweil

Deep programation on control after touch, nice controllers, great keyboard...
His sex dungeons are rumored to hold hundreds of people in secret locations around the world.
https://soundcloud.com/balma

Mooger5
Expert Member
Expert Member
Posts: 1459
Joined: Tue May 06, 2008 5:11 pm
Location: Lisbon

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by Mooger5 » Mon Aug 17, 2009 11:44 pm

JB wrote: I remember testing a K2500 when it was first released in '96 and embarassingly needing to ask the store assistant for the manuals before being able to figure out how to change the filter cut-off freq (as the program that I was editing didn't have a filter in the algorythm by default).
My embarassing moment with the K2000 was in the studio where I worked, in the middle of a session. The manual was as thick as a phonebook and after spending a week digesting it I had completely forgotten about the parameter lock function that prevents from editing the sounds inadvertently during playback. Ten minutes after I told the customers there might be a bug in the operating system, the senior tech arrives, presses one of the multi-function buttons and unlocks the damned thing #-o :^o

...where the algorythm is made up of three changable DSP "blocks" with varying interconnections it all makes sense.
Totally. It´s basically a software modular synth.
Herrare umanum est.

Mooger5
Expert Member
Expert Member
Posts: 1459
Joined: Tue May 06, 2008 5:11 pm
Location: Lisbon

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by Mooger5 » Tue Aug 18, 2009 12:21 am

balma wrote:what is most important here is:

Kurzweil are high quality instruments. If you can get one for a reasonable price do not hesitate. This synths are great for acoustic instruments, they take a lot care on sound quality of strings, pianos. Special for keyboard
performance and being expressive.
You can see on VH1 lots of virtuous keyboard players using kurzweil

Deep programation on control after touch, nice controllers, great keyboard...
Definitely. The K series are the standard for Romplers, not only because of the features, but also because the sound-quality has to be one of the best ever. There´s a preset in the K2K I´ll never forget. It´s the Mondo Bass. Check it on Synthmania, although the soundfile doesn´t make it much justice, as playing live it sounds gigantic. Some sounds from the K are so powerful and thick it can be a problem fitting them in the mix ´cause they shout above the others. One time I stopped by an outdoor concert and the keyboard player had a K2600 and a Korg M1. Both keyboards were on a two-tier stand so I could see which one was being played. I was familiar with both synth engines, but it was something of a shock that the M1 next to the Kurzweil sounded like tin cans!

Be aware though of the ones with hammered key actions. During transportation the keys have a tendency to fall off. Because of that I think it´s the PC88 or something that you´ll find selling for almost nothing.

One known hit song is "Children" by Robert Miles. The piano, spanish guitar and I believe the bass samples are the K2K. And ironically, there´s some M1 sounds in the song too.
Herrare umanum est.

shadyjake
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:36 am

Re: Digital V.A.S.T

Post by shadyjake » Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:07 am

what are more keyboards that have VAST or something like it? something where i can manipulate samples. cuz thats all im doin now. but if i can find something that does more than a KP...and my pedals then im def gonna want to buy it

Post Reply