ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Discussions about anything analog, digital, MIDI, synth technology, techniques, theories and more.
KBD_TRACKER
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 222
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 11:10 am

ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by KBD_TRACKER » Mon May 03, 2010 8:45 pm

I am talking about all the synths commercially available right now. And not only the "stars" (voyager, andromeda, etc.) but also the middle and bottom shelf ones ... microkorg, micron, the new rolands and korgs, etc. because someday (soon enough) they'll stop being made. And then of course at that stage people will start reminiscing ... and going "that machine indeed WAS special, too bad it was not appreciated in those days... ". and then, if some people find a way to tweak it or play it in a new way, and use it in a new emerging style of music, collectors and merchants will do their usual thing: and all of a sudden ... a "vintage" synth is born !

So next time at GC you see a synth, ugly, plasticky and all, overpriced, nasty sounding, limited, with cheap controls .... well in 10-15 years, imagine ... you'll probably find people raving about that very same synth and preaching how it is such special instrument !

even the poor EX800 has its followers and afficionados. ( i should know, i have one...)

So this leads to my main question : except for connotating age, does the term "vintage" truly has any sense ?

User avatar
Z
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 3546
Joined: Wed May 09, 2007 3:08 am
Gear: Bubble wrap, Styrofoam, boxes, packing tape
Location: Docking Bay 94 (Dallas, TX)
Contact:

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by Z » Mon May 03, 2010 8:48 pm

So where's the love for the early 90's ROMplers (Emu Proteus series, Kawai K1 & K4, and such)?

KBD_TRACKER
Junior Member
Junior Member
Posts: 222
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 11:10 am

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by KBD_TRACKER » Mon May 03, 2010 8:59 pm

Z wrote:So where's the love for the early 90's ROMplers (Emu Proteus series, Kawai K1 & K4, and such)?
well, i am talking about the concept of "vintageness", not necessarily "love". besides many "aknowledged" vintage machines do not seem loved per se. but just appreciated for what they are.

nvbrkr
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 812
Joined: Fri May 09, 2008 8:14 pm
Gear: An electric piano and analog synths.
Location: Helsinki, Finland

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by nvbrkr » Mon May 03, 2010 9:12 pm

As for the "main question". "vintage" connotes desirability as well. Many home organs from the 60s-80s are certainly old, but they're not sought after. As for VSE having granted "vintage" status for a lot of the newer units lately, well, I think it's more of an attempt at neutrality. There's very little reason to call the Moog Voyager a "vintage synth" as of yet, but it still retains its association with the Moog synths of the past due to the similarities in design.

The EX-800 is a Poly-800 in a module format. Regardless of its shortcomings it has a design that would be quite hard to emulate 100% convincingly with today's technology. It also shares many aspects of its design with the bigger Korg polysynths of the era. So in that sense it is "vintage by association", I guess.

Some 00s VAs and ROMplers might become "vintage" one day, but most units are far too similar to each other design-wise to really stand out. I don't see a reason why the as-of-yet-manufactured units couldn't generate similar sounds -- even with 99-100% accuracy -- thus keeping the desirability of the originals rather low.

User avatar
CS_TBL
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 1677
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 3:47 pm
Gear: All "In-The-Box"
Mainly FM8
Location: NL
Contact:

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by CS_TBL » Mon May 03, 2010 9:13 pm

If ever, I think Roland only deserves vintageness for 1 (one) sound canvas, not for all the gazillions o' sound canvas based keyboards, arrangers, modules, workstations, midi file players and synths (JV30 e.g.).

Well, maybe not even that.. just no vintage status for any sound canvas, hmmkay? It completely ruined the diversity of the 80's.
"You know I love you, CS, but this is bullshit." (Automatic Gainsay)
s: VSL/FM8/EWQL/LASS h: DX7/FS1r/VL70/SY77/SN2r/JD800/JD990/XV88/Emu6400/Poly61/Amek35:12:2/genelec1030 r: Violin/AltoSax/TinWhistle c: i7-4770/RAM32GB/SSD
FM8 vids

User avatar
th0mas
Expert Member
Expert Member
Posts: 1349
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 5:27 pm
Gear: oakley tm3030/mopho keys/midibox sid/tr-707/tama techstars/monotron
Band: GRAVITRONIC
Location: Ontario
Contact:

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by th0mas » Mon May 03, 2010 11:28 pm

nvbrkr wrote:Many home organs from the 60s-80s are certainly old, but they're not sought after.
I have to say one of the side benefits of the "watching craigslist" hobby is the periodic ads that go up 1 month at a time:

"RARE VINTAGE ORGAN $2000 PAID $5000"
"VINTAGE ORGAN $1000"
"ORGAN $500"
"ORGAN $100 MUST SELL"
"FREE:ORGAN AT THE CURB"

I feel bad for the people who paid close to the price of a new car for these things, used them for ~2 hours as an instrument at 30 years as a bulky but decorative piece of furniture. But their ads still make me laugh.

User avatar
Yoozer
Expert Member
Expert Member
Posts: 1390
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 1:31 pm

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by Yoozer » Mon May 03, 2010 11:29 pm

Z wrote:So where's the love for the early 90's ROMplers (Emu Proteus series, Kawai K1 & K4, and such)?
Lots of love for the JD series. Kawai, not so much (mostly because it sounds c**p) - and the Proteus was a fixed-structure and perhaps even watered down version of what the E-mu sample libraries already offered, so have a sampler and the library and you'll have something better.

See also http://www.synthmania.com/l-cdx-02_keyb ... uments.htm and others - none of that 32kHz "16 megabyte when converted to linear format"-c**p.
"Part of an instrument is what it can do, and part of it is what you do to it" - Suzanne Ciani, 197x.

User avatar
Z
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 3546
Joined: Wed May 09, 2007 3:08 am
Gear: Bubble wrap, Styrofoam, boxes, packing tape
Location: Docking Bay 94 (Dallas, TX)
Contact:

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by Z » Tue May 04, 2010 12:15 am

Yoozer wrote:
Z wrote:So where's the love for the early 90's ROMplers (Emu Proteus series, Kawai K1 & K4, and such)?
Lots of love for the JD series.
INDEED! The JD-800 is pretty much my main axe. I've got the 990, too.

What about the D-5/10/20/110 & MT-32?

User avatar
pricklyrobot
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 1742
Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2006 6:37 am
Location: Austin, TX

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by pricklyrobot » Tue May 04, 2010 12:59 am

KBD_TRACKER wrote:does the term "vintage" truly has have any sense ?
Not any objective one, no. It's a just a nonsense word you use to make the c**p you couldn't give away your garage sale sound better on Ebay.

And in this era of desperate anticipation of future nostalgia (behold, the kitsch vortex approaches singularity!), it's going to continue to be used more and mean less.
Arturia MiniBrute -- bits o' Euro -- Sammich SID -- E-mu MP-7 -- Korg ER-1 -- Thingamagoop

User avatar
th0mas
Expert Member
Expert Member
Posts: 1349
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 5:27 pm
Gear: oakley tm3030/mopho keys/midibox sid/tr-707/tama techstars/monotron
Band: GRAVITRONIC
Location: Ontario
Contact:

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by th0mas » Tue May 04, 2010 1:42 am

You know, I thought this topic was really dumb until I thought of the yamaha shs-10. Maybe OP is right.

User avatar
hfinn
Expert Member
Expert Member
Posts: 1197
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 3:21 pm
Gear: http://soundcloud.com/heath-finnie
Location: Boston
Contact:

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by hfinn » Tue May 04, 2010 4:12 am

KBD_TRACKER wrote:So this leads to my main question : except for connotating age, does the term "vintage" truly has any sense ?
No. Vintage does not equal value.

Scories
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 617
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 8:57 pm
Gear: Micromoog, JX-3P, Minikorg 700, Z1
Location: Québec - CANADA
Contact:

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by Scories » Tue May 04, 2010 4:34 am

[Aside the age factor,] I would be tempted to say that novelty and rarity (uniqueness) must be among the most decisive factors that makes a piece of gear desirable. SidStation and Fizmo are rare & unique sounding synths. That makes them desirable, even if we would not use them that much in our style of music. Yamaha VL-1 is an other example. Future classics.

I also realised that the Korg Z1 and the Microwave XT are very unique synths. And even if they are not currently hard to find in the used market, they will probably become sought-after in the future. That's one of the reasons why I've decided to keep them.

But most high end digital stuff can be outdated soon. Today's novelty is often tomorrow's junk. But with lo-fi gear, the situation can be different. Because they have a specific character that can be hard to reproduce.
For instance, I had a blast playing with a Commodore 64 Cynthcart recently.
Last edited by Scories on Tue May 04, 2010 5:59 am, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
loungedumore
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 638
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2007 10:25 am
Gear: iMac | iPad 2| iPad Air
Beatstep Pro | Mpx8
Volca bass, Keys ,beats
Monotribe | MS20 | SQ1
Minibrute | Midi4+
Graphite 49 | EIE
Band: Death By Media
Location: Indiana
Contact:

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by loungedumore » Tue May 04, 2010 4:45 am

In someone's eyes this is considered vintage
Image


Nuff said
Some wish to leave their mark ... I want to leave a scar .
http://soundcloud.com/death-by-media

User avatar
Stab Frenzy
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9723
Joined: Tue Jun 06, 2006 5:41 pm
Gear: Eurorack, RYTM, Ultranova, many FX
Location: monster island*
Contact:

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by Stab Frenzy » Tue May 04, 2010 5:24 am

Vintage = Old, that's all.

Saying a synth is a vintage synth doesn't mean you're saying it's good. I'm surprised that so many people don't know what that word means.

User avatar
crystalmsc
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 2862
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:15 am
Gear: uWaveXT,uQ,Pulse+;Ion;MiniBrt,Karma,Mntrb,Volcas,01R;Venom,NordModular,L2X;Evolver;JP8080,MKS70,JD990,D50,MC909,MC80ex,Microcon2;TG77,RS7k,AN200,AN1x
Band: Crystaline
Location: Synth Garden
Contact:

Re: ALL synths will eventually become vintage for somebody

Post by crystalmsc » Tue May 04, 2010 5:44 am

Z wrote:
Yoozer wrote:Lots of love for the JD series.
INDEED! The JD-800 is pretty much my main axe. I've got the 990, too.
Also a fan of the JD-990, a vintage rompler at best.
Z wrote:What about the D-5/10/20/110 & MT-32?
I always like the D-110 as the D-50 complement.

As Many people are still enjoying old pc games and music, like the Sierra stuffs. The MT-32 and other CM line are already a classic for that purpose. Followed by the SC and Yamaha MU.
Kaossilatron - Voicillator
http://crystaline.bandcamp.com
Station: Ableton Live 10 Suite, Obscurium, Push 2, Ultranova, MS-20m, Wavedrums

Post Reply