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Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 5:49 pm
by MrFrodo
Could I make a comment about this "issue"? One of the things I've learned about Moog and DSI is that the latter has taken great steps to integrate its previously-acquired knowledge of digital circuitry with its longer-standing knowledge of analog synthesis. Moog is a company which has never ventured into the digital synthesis realm, at least not with any of its standard production models. They're going on what they're familiar with.

Except for the Animoog and other virtual models, can any of you honestly picture a Moog synth similar to the Evolver series (or one of the 80's period D/A hybrids such as the DW-8000, the ESQ-1 or the Prophet 2000)? Or, can you see them building a drum&bass synthesizer similar to the Tempest ? They'd need an R&D staffer who has extensive experience with classic hybrid designs (other than microprocessor control as in the Memorymoog) to build such a model.

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:15 pm
by Blue Monster 65
This is true, but why should they do that? They (Moog) fulfilling what they see as a need in the marketplace (and their sales seem to confirm that) and they will probably continue to do that, regardless of what other companies do. DSI seem to be doing the same thing, only in a different direction. Frankly, that's what more companies should do, instead of trying to be everything to everybody.

We're getting away from the original subject here, though, and that's partly my fault. I just think that taking shots at Moog because you don't like what they're doing is cheap. It's hard to compare the Tempest with anything Moog is doing, regardless of how you try and it's not worth doing, either.

So, is the Tempest worth every penny you pay for it? YES. Does it do analog drum sounds and more? Yes. Can it be used for analog synthesis beyond drum sounds? Yes. Would it make a powerful addition to almost any setup? Yes. I say if you're thinking of buying one and have been doing your research and think you might like it, my advice is to save your pennies and BUY ONE. You'll be happy you did!

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:19 pm
by themilford
MrFrodo wrote: They'd need an R&D staffer who has extensive experience with classic hybrid designs (other than microprocessor control as in the Memorymoog) to build such a model.
The industry is teeming with such people... Moog could simply pluck one from the field.

I've worked in this industry a long time and know a lot of engineers... All Moog would have to do is hint that they were looking for a few engineers with this set of skills and they would have their pick.

Knowing this, I would have to trust that a company's MO is of aesthetic choice and not of limited attribute... as that attribute can be easily created at whim.

There are a lot of hungry, young, talented engineers out there. If Moog wanted to make a Virtual/DSP/Wavetable/sampler/vector based piece of kit tomorrow... they would only be a a few resumes away.

Moog and DSI seem to be a logical continuation of their heritage, passion and vibe... same with Tom Oberheim.

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:28 pm
by MrFrodo
themilford wrote: Moog and DSI seem to be a logical continuation of their heritage, passion and vibe... same with Tom Oberheim.
I like your prospective.

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:39 pm
by Blue Monster 65
MrFrodo wrote:
themilford wrote: Moog and DSI seem to be a logical continuation of their heritage, passion and vibe... same with Tom Oberheim.
I like your prospective.
Seconded.

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:50 pm
by nathanscribe
musden wrote:Sorry, but I cant imagine that anybody who interested in soundesign or in musical value would be buying such devices. That devices are poor as musical instruments, in my opinion.
Then, in my opinion, you lack imagination. If you cannot conceive of a monophonic, analogue synth without presets, MIDI or effects as a valid musical instrument, then you are missing the point - the point being, a musician - a creative mind - can get interesting results from what you perceive as unworkable limitations. Pushing at the edges of the limitations of any particular device is the domain of the imaginative.

Ever played a cello, flute, or even sung anything? Ever hit something with a stick and wondered what you could do with that in a piece? Ever listened to the noise a train makes as it cools down between stops and imagined melodies and rhythmic structures around that? Ever tried to make a piece of music with only one note?

People buy Moog kit for various reasons, and I'm sure some of them do buy Moog for the badge, just as some will buy a particular car for reasons other than how good it is for the drive to work or doing the shopping. But many people who buy Moog do so because they like the synths, they like the sound, they like the way things work, they like the type of interaction that comes with that - and when a musician enjoys working with something, perhaps they can get better results.

You make music, if that's what you do, with whatever you like. Let others do the same.

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 7:21 pm
by GuyaGuy
nathanscribe wrote: Ever played a cello, flute, or even sung anything? Ever hit something with a stick and wondered what you could do with that in a piece? Ever listened to the noise a train makes as it cools down between stops and imagined melodies and rhythmic structures around that? Ever tried to make a piece of music with only one note?
If your flute doesn't have MIDI and presets, you're just living in the past, man!

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 7:30 pm
by MrFrodo
GuyaGuy wrote: If your flute doesn't have MIDI and presets, you're just living in the past, man!
I'd say "Har de har har," if I didn't know about the EWI.

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 7:32 pm
by nathanscribe
GuyaGuy wrote:
nathanscribe wrote: Ever played a cello, flute, or even sung anything? Ever hit something with a stick and wondered what you could do with that in a piece? Ever listened to the noise a train makes as it cools down between stops and imagined melodies and rhythmic structures around that? Ever tried to make a piece of music with only one note?
If your flute doesn't have MIDI and presets, you're just living in the past, man!
Yeah, but you should see my InterCity control surface.

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 8:46 pm
by Blue Monster 65
NO! Don't you dare ask to see it!

You do and then Tallow will join in, along with Balma, Stabbers, Spaceboy and Joey and this thread will just become a complete Freak Fest.

Seriously. Don't.

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 11:46 pm
by Stab Frenzy
musden wrote:
ColorForm2113 wrote:so what qualifies a synthesizer as a good instrument is whether or not it would have been popular in the 80's? :roll:
lol )) Many synth obviously have produced after 80s. Tempest is very capable, in some ways innovative, so in my mind it is great musical instrument. There are, however, some toys and so-called gadgets like minitaur, monotron etc - they are just funny things. All moog synths now, I think, pretty poor. Analog - so what? Monophonic - what a f**k? Many users on the forum are really happy, when somebody planning to produce new analog (or whatever else) toy, and they arent have any need in some useful features - polyphony, presets, midi, modulations - oh no-no! What for we need polyphony, this real analog thing, you dont need it, it is enough for you that we made analog (for example) toy - finally, you can have warmth sound and bass. But in such cases I cant see that producers really care about music or musical value. Electronic music gave us wide opportunities for creating new sounds, timbres, along with melodic component of composition. Tempest is an instrument, not a toy (though, people can use it like a toy), created in competitive environment. Most of moogs, especially minitaur, are based on the brand and poor synths for nowadays. But for many people it is OK.
This is a thread about the Tempest, it's not about your prejudices against Moog instruments. Please don't use it as such.

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 1:16 am
by lazerface
so..uhh...back to what I was asking,

Tempest owners out there - can it cover the Little Phatty's territory as a standalone synth?
ignoring the appeal of the signature Moog sound for second..(I do like the sound of the Mopho too)

Or would you hang onto the Phatty and take the extra time to save up the cash?

Also, post some fresh Tempest demos! :P

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 3:47 am
by Blue Monster 65
I don't know that I'd use the Tempest as a stand-alone synth. You could but it would be much easier (and cheaper) for you if you wanted to augment your LP with a Mopho Keyboard or, for roughly the same amount of money, add a Tetra to it, controlling the Tetra with the LP. Frankly, for me, that would be the way to go if you're looking to cover all your bases (both Moog and DSI sounds + some amount of polyphony).

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 4:04 am
by sequentialsoftshock
Stab Frenzy wrote:
musden wrote:
ColorForm2113 wrote:so what qualifies a synthesizer as a good instrument is whether or not it would have been popular in the 80's? :roll:
lol )) Many synth obviously have produced after 80s. Tempest is very capable, in some ways innovative, so in my mind it is great musical instrument. There are, however, some toys and so-called gadgets like minitaur, monotron etc - they are just funny things. All moog synths now, I think, pretty poor. Analog - so what? Monophonic - what a f**k? Many users on the forum are really happy, when somebody planning to produce new analog (or whatever else) toy, and they arent have any need in some useful features - polyphony, presets, midi, modulations - oh no-no! What for we need polyphony, this real analog thing, you dont need it, it is enough for you that we made analog (for example) toy - finally, you can have warmth sound and bass. But in such cases I cant see that producers really care about music or musical value. Electronic music gave us wide opportunities for creating new sounds, timbres, along with melodic component of composition. Tempest is an instrument, not a toy (though, people can use it like a toy), created in competitive environment. Most of moogs, especially minitaur, are based on the brand and poor synths for nowadays. But for many people it is OK.
This is a thread about the Tempest, it's not about your prejudices against Moog instruments. Please don't use it as such.
Yeah, dumbass, stop living in the 22nd century! There are plenty of cats using the Tempest as not only a drum box, but a badass 6 voice synthesiZer. 8-)

Re: New DSI instrument!

Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 4:09 am
by MrFrodo
Blue Monster 65 wrote:I don't know that I'd use the Tempest as a stand-alone synth. You could but it would be much easier (and cheaper) for you if you wanted to augment your LP with a Mopho Keyboard or, for roughly the same amount of money, add a Tetra to it, controlling the Tetra with the LP. Frankly, for me, that would be the way to go if you're looking to cover all your bases (both Moog and DSI sounds + some amount of polyphony).
I was just giving the Tetra another look this afternoon. Not bad at all for a four-voice analog synth module priced under $1,000. Probably not as controllable as a Tempest when it comes to drum sequencing, but I agree that it'd be good as a drum&bass source. The demos I've heard almost put me in mind of the Studio 440.

(Not to mention, the effects coming from those demos reminded me of the VCS3.)