If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

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RD9
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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by RD9 » Fri Mar 04, 2011 12:49 am

I don't think expressing these opinions is a waste because if korg is looking for ideas to move to the next level of analog development they will need some ideas. For instance if the success of the monotron has given them enough confidence that enough people are interested in analog then they will naturally develop a more robust model next. and that is where feedback may be useful.

And if people can provide them with ideas for how to gain an edge over competitors like DSI, Vermona, and Doepfer then they may consider them. For the company I work for, we usually develop ideas internally first based on profitability, but we often look all over the place for additional ideas to gain an edge over competitors.

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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by Stab Frenzy » Fri Mar 04, 2011 12:20 pm

Perhaps that would be the case if this was an email to korg, or a conversation with one of korg's marketing managers, or even a forum on korg's website. John Korg hardly even looks at this forum any more, I doubt the message is gonna get through to him.

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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by RD9 » Fri Mar 04, 2011 4:29 pm

That's no reason not to discuss the possibilities. Why be negative? This is a discussion forum after all. Also, there is a tendency for good ideas to propagate very quickly like memes. And it doesn't take much for a small idea to make its way all the way to the top through just a few people. I see it happen all the time. And it doesn't really cost us anything here to explore ideas, so why not?

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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by Phollop Willing PA » Fri Mar 04, 2011 8:36 pm

RD9 wrote:That's no reason not to discuss the possibilities. Why be negative? This is a discussion forum after all. Also, there is a tendency for good ideas to propagate very quickly like memes. And it doesn't take much for a small idea to make its way all the way to the top through just a few people. I see it happen all the time. And it doesn't really cost us anything here to explore ideas, so why not?
Agreed.

Also, if Korg isn't trolling message boards like this, they are not doing enough market research and in my opinion, would be irresponsible.

If I was trying to put out a synth or related, that people like me and others might be interested in, I'd better listen to the consumer if I wanted to move forward with a good product.

You can't fault someone like Ken MacBeth of MacBeth synths, in that department as he's all over gauging opinions.
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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by tallowwaters » Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:09 pm

Phollop Willing PA wrote:I'm surprised Korg didn't cram a Monotron in their Chronos. :?
Dude, wtf is your obsession with the Kronos? Are we going to read about you on the news after having been arrested for stalking one of the members of the development team?
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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by smoothcriminal » Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:13 pm

RD9 wrote:Why be negative?
That's a great question and broadly applicable recently. I can't imagine the mindset that actually gets angry over synthesizer speculation and discussion.

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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by Phollop Willing PA » Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:41 pm

tallowwaters wrote:
Phollop Willing PA wrote:I'm surprised Korg didn't cram a Monotron in their Chronos. :?
Dude, wtf is your obsession with the Kronos? Are we going to read about you on the news after having been arrested for stalking one of the members of the development team?
Doode, you couldn't be more wrong. My obsession is with MacBeths right now. The question is, are we going to read about you stalking someone at VSE?

I enjoy a spirited discussion of new products and the game hasn't changed one bit, but it's gotten more convoluted. :lol: Personal commentary is only relevant if it's on topic, yours wasn't.

Back to Kronos, please.
smoothcriminal wrote:
RD9 wrote:Why be negative?
That's a great question and broadly applicable recently. I can't imagine the mindset that actually gets angry over synthesizer speculation and discussion.
Agreed!
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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by tallowwaters » Fri Mar 04, 2011 9:47 pm

smoothcriminal wrote:
RD9 wrote:Why be negative?
That's a great question and broadly applicable recently. I can't imagine the mindset that actually gets angry over synthesizer speculation and discussion.
Nobody is angry, it's just a general bemusement over these type of threads. (I should note that I don't care either way).

I don't think either of you have been here long enough to know how this pattern works or remember some of our more 'epic' VA threads. People speculate (nay, complain) about manufacturers making what they (and probably a total of 70 other people) want. Manufacturer makes said product, then those very same people complain because it isn't multitimbral, shiny enough, making their boring twinkle sequences more interesting, or whatever.

Trust me, if you were here for the shitstorm that was the release of the MEK, you would know. I believe that thread was 40 pages of some of the most ludicrous bitching and moaning I've ever read in my life.
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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by StepLogik » Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:03 pm

tallowwaters wrote: Trust me, if you were here for the shitstorm that was the release of the MEK, you would know. I believe that thread was 40 pages of some of the most ludicrous bitching and moaning I've ever read in my life.
you read it? i didn't bother :lol:

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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by tallowwaters » Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:43 pm

StepLogik wrote:
tallowwaters wrote: Trust me, if you were here for the shitstorm that was the release of the MEK, you would know. I believe that thread was 40 pages of some of the most ludicrous bitching and moaning I've ever read in my life.
you read it? i didn't bother :lol:
I had to; I was the only active mod at the time.
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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by tekkentool » Fri Mar 04, 2011 11:29 pm

I've almost entirely stopped caring if the big 3 companies decide to make new analogue gear. We have the DSI/Doepfer/Moog/MFB/Analogue solutions gear and enough modular gear to cause a solar eclipse. For once in your life be happy knowing that you have never had more options for how you buy synth gear than right now.

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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by Phollop Willing PA » Fri Mar 04, 2011 11:37 pm

tekkentool wrote:I've almost entirely stopped caring if the big 3 companies decide to make new analogue gear. We have the DSI/Doepfer/Moog/MFB/Analogue solutions gear and enough modular gear to cause a solar eclipse. For once in your life be happy knowing that you have never had more options for how you buy synth gear than right now.
Beautiful and well stated. Thank-you. Now to my MacBeth with fresh inspirations.

Bye bye Kronos, I'll be watching for you, and the next 'game changer'. :lol:
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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by steveman » Sat Mar 05, 2011 12:11 am

RD9 wrote:I don't think expressing these opinions is a waste because if korg is looking for ideas to move to the next level of analog development they will need some ideas...

And if people can provide them with ideas for how to gain an edge over competitors like DSI, Vermona, and Doepfer then they may consider them.
Gain an edge??? :shock:
What have we come up with so far?
A 2 osc monosynth with no profit margin... no one's ever thought of that before.
That German fantasy synth says it all - everything and the kitchen but no one would pay over $1000 for one.

Wy would they, the market is tiny, If you look here, Harmony Central, Gearslutz, Mufwiggler (forums where they discuss synths as opposed to keyboards) you'll see the same people posting . Maybe there's another 10 people out there for every poster. Even if they sold to every single person who claims to be interested (they won't) there'll probably be no more than a couple of thousand sales.
(Re Internet forums as an indicator of demand - 1 modular maker put up a notice asking for people who were really serious about buying a part to contact him, over 400 people replied, how many did he sell to those claiming to be interested? - 9 sales).

So for those few sales Korg would have to hire analogue electronic engineers (they don't have these any more), source parts (many of which are now unavailable), a new production line, much more rigorous testing and calibration procedures at the end. No economy of scale there.

There's plenty of analogue stuff out there, so it costs more than you want to pay - deal with it. In modular land there's new, innovative modules being released every couple of weeks - by my reckoning there's currently around 400 different eurorack format modules available. Build your own synth from these, analogue, digital, MS20 clone, whatever you want.

Only reason people want the big 3 to build an analogue synth it because they think they'll be cheaper.

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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by smoothcriminal » Sat Mar 05, 2011 12:30 am

steveman wrote:So for those few sales Korg would have to hire analogue electronic engineers (they don't have these any more), source parts (many of which are now unavailable), a new production line, much more rigorous testing and calibration procedures at the end. No economy of scale there.
By "any more" you mean since they began designing & mass-producing analog Monotrons? The production of which was not evidently not hampered by part sourcing or rigorous testing and calibration? I disagree with the logic being used here.

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Re: If Korg can make a Monotron that sells for $65...

Post by RD9 » Sat Mar 05, 2011 12:48 am

steveman wrote:
RD9 wrote:I don't think expressing these opinions is a waste because if korg is looking for ideas to move to the next level of analog development they will need some ideas...

And if people can provide them with ideas for how to gain an edge over competitors like DSI, Vermona, and Doepfer then they may consider them.
Gain an edge??? :shock:
What have we come up with so far?
A 2 osc monosynth with no profit margin... no one's ever thought of that before.
That German fantasy synth says it all - everything and the kitchen but no one would pay over $1000 for one.

Wy would they, the market is tiny, If you look here, Harmony Central, Gearslutz, Mufwiggler (forums where they discuss synths as opposed to keyboards) you'll see the same people posting . Maybe there's another 10 people out there for every poster. Even if they sold to every single person who claims to be interested (they won't) there'll probably be no more than a couple of thousand sales.
(Re Internet forums as an indicator of demand - 1 modular maker put up a notice asking for people who were really serious about buying a part to contact him, over 400 people replied, how many did he sell to those claiming to be interested? - 9 sales).
I think you're thinking too narrowly. The internet does not only serve as an indicator of demand; it can also serve as a source for ideas and innovation.

You are right to a certain degree... that the market for analog is tinier than digital. But the size of the market is only as relevant as the amount you invest in a product. Furthermore, if you are able to come up with an excellent product, the value that this adds to your brand propagates to your other products as well.

Finally, I think you underestimate the possiblities of a cheap analog synth. Personally I believe that it's possible to develop a cheap but powerful analog product that makes everyone happy and is still profitable. Finding where the sweet spot is the challenge.

For example, if you build on top of the Dark Energy or Moogerfooger patterns and figure out a way to make them cheaper, it could work. Think of a cross between a Monotron and a Dark Energy... what would you get?

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