What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by knolan » Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:56 pm

Excellent point!

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by el-folie » Tue Apr 18, 2017 8:52 pm

I don´t think there are tuned fifths in the 'Blade Runner Blues' patch. Also, when you listen with headphones you clearly hear the oscillators almost exactly in tune to give it that sharp piercing beating that only the CS-80 can deliver with that biting metallic resonance. Of course only Vangelis will know for shure and Knolan if he´d try the sound on his synths.

Here´s my attempt:
https://soundcloud.com/ancientsoul73/br-bluesimpro

Concerning the thread question the synth in that particular scene shortly before Deckard tests Rachel is the VP-330 vocoder synth.

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by Bitexion » Wed Apr 19, 2017 6:17 am

It's funny how we analyze these songs to death, when Vangelis most like just pushed two preset buttons and though "Hm this sounds nice through my reverb" and wrote the soundtrack around it.

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by segerfalk » Wed Apr 19, 2017 8:42 am

el-folie wrote:I don´t think there are tuned fifths in the 'Blade Runner Blues' patch. Also, when you listen with headphones you clearly hear the oscillators almost exactly in tune to give it that sharp piercing beating that only the CS-80 can deliver with that biting metallic resonance. Of course only Vangelis will know for shure and Knolan if he´d try the sound on his synths.

Here´s my attempt:
https://soundcloud.com/ancientsoul73/br-bluesimpro

Concerning the thread question the synth in that particular scene shortly before Deckard tests Rachel is the VP-330 vocoder synth.
Definitely no fifths! Your rendition is nice, but I hear the odd sub-sinus and ofc the delay effect, which isn't in the original.

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by segerfalk » Wed Apr 19, 2017 8:43 am

Bitexion wrote:It's funny how we analyze these songs to death, when Vangelis most like just pushed two preset buttons and though "Hm this sounds nice through my reverb" and wrote the soundtrack around it.
True for many of the songs, but not the BR Blues ;) It's the hunt for the holy grail ofc!

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by el-folie » Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:30 am

segerfalk wrote:
el-folie wrote:I don´t think there are tuned fifths in the 'Blade Runner Blues' patch. Also, when you listen with headphones you clearly hear the oscillators almost exactly in tune to give it that sharp piercing beating that only the CS-80 can deliver with that biting metallic resonance. Of course only Vangelis will know for shure and Knolan if he´d try the sound on his synths.

Here´s my attempt:
https://soundcloud.com/ancientsoul73/br-bluesimpro

Concerning the thread question the synth in that particular scene shortly before Deckard tests Rachel is the VP-330 vocoder synth.


Definitely no fifths! Your rendition is nice, but I hear the odd sub-sinus and ofc the delay effect, which isn't in the original.

Well, if you listen to the original brb with headphones you can hear three delays, one right, one left, one in the middle, all of them timed perfectly to each other with one repeat, most obvious on louder short notes. Also one can clearly hear the octave/sub sine which is quietly bringing in space, depth and bass.

What was the hardest doing the brb was to get that metallic piercing sound right with the slow beating frequency, I compared and tunef the sound forever and even then it wasnt perfect because the cs80 live controls were missing.

Two things are off in my attempt: Only one (bad) delay used and the seasick slow lfo doesnt respond to aftertouch and so doesnt change its speed which is a pity.

I wish I had a cs80, a real dream machine. If I were Knolan Id do the damn brb and put this to rest for all us die hard synth investigators ;)

Edit: And thanks for the compliment - it´s been quite a lot of work to get close :happy3: :facepalm:
Edit2: At 03:29 in on the original brb you can hear the 3 delays which create that incredible depth ontop the reverb.
Last edited by el-folie on Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by ppg_wavecomputer » Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:38 am

I have a CS80 but I could never be bothered to play BRB.

Why?

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by el-folie » Wed Apr 19, 2017 10:08 am

ppg_wavecomputer wrote:I have a CS80 but I could never be bothered to play BRB.

Why?

Stephen
Well, of course the reason depends. For some people not owning a cs80, its pure sound and its features demonstrated like in brb are somewhat a mystery. Knowing, seeing, hearing how its done brings you nearer to that mystery and emotional response without actually owning a cs80.

But at the same time Im not sure if de-mystfying is always a good thing because when its done its done. Most of the time ones own approach is what is most gratifying towards doing things.

If I had a cs80 and having it played and heard to death I also wouldnt feel the need to do the brb (again). But I would do it for those synth fans who cherish the sound and would like to know how its done. And Id take a photo of the control settings so anyone could think 'uhh ohh yeah well, I was nearly there' and so on... ;)

To myself the brb and Enos prophecy theme are iconic and I understand why people are deeply fascinated by the sound, the machines, the process of doing and hearing it for themselves, to relive it.

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by Bitexion » Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:14 am

ppg_wavecomputer wrote:I have a CS80 but I could never be bothered to play BRB.

Why?

Stephen
Probably because you know it can do a million other sounds, being a fully fledged 2 VCO polysynth that can do more than slow brass sounds that someone else got famous for?

It's like buying a Jupiter-8 for $8000 and only play duran duran patches on it, say "oh well, that's that then" and leave it off for another 5 years.

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by ppg_wavecomputer » Wed Apr 19, 2017 10:30 pm

Bitexion wrote:
ppg_wavecomputer wrote:I have a CS80 but I could never be bothered to play BRB.

Why?

Stephen
Probably because you know it can do a million other sounds, being a fully fledged 2 VCO polysynth that can do more than slow brass sounds that someone else got famous for? [...]
I guess this is a pretty good observation.

I've had people complain about the CS80 demoes I uploaded to Soundcloud because they didn't quite sound the way a CS80 is supposed to sound like...

Playing Vangelis tunes is quite a bit of fun, too -- but tends to become a bit of an old hat fairly quickly. Taking Vangelis as a starting point and evolving one's own unique technique and approach to the instrument from there is more fun.

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by knolan » Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:11 pm

el-folie wrote:I don´t think there are tuned fifths in the 'Blade Runner Blues' patch. Also, when you listen with headphones you clearly hear the oscillators almost exactly in tune to give it that sharp piercing beating that only the CS-80 can deliver with that biting metallic resonance. Of course only Vangelis will know for shure and Knolan if he´d try the sound on his synths.

Here´s my attempt:
https://soundcloud.com/ancientsoul73/br-bluesimpro

Concerning the thread question the synth in that particular scene shortly before Deckard tests Rachel is the VP-330 vocoder synth.
My two project studio rooms totally disassembled - rebuilding both of them and taking forever so can't try anything for some months :-(

You are right - we've lost track of the original point. The sound you're referring to is the "Human Voice" tone available on the VP330. It's not the vocoder - the VP330 offers three facilities - Strings, Vocoder and that stunning "Human Voice" - Male and Female voices, 8" and 4", both an "Ahh" tone. Vangelis uses it to astounding effect in that scene - it's very much bathed in chorus and reverb. He uses it on Chariots of Fire, The friends of Mr Cairo, See You Later and numerous albums at the time. It's also used by Tangerine Dream to great effect on their album Hyperboria.

Vangelis get so much out of the VP330 because he layers them, and as said, bathes them in chorus and Lexicon reverb. But - his use of voicings and chords are what really nail it. He uses chords with 9th and 4th (11ths) to create great tension in that Human Voice sound; while when playing the VP330 Strings his chord progressions are very well crafted and imbues his string playing with tension, drama and 'life'.

The use of that Human Voice in that scene seems to marry perfectly with the lighting and mood set by Ridley Scott. But note the careful use of Fender Rhodes and other delicate instruments too - it's the fusion of them all that engenders the sound with a sense of 'light'.

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by Mooger5 » Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:23 pm

Some famous sound getting more attention in a forum is just that. I find it hard to believe people are buying OBX-As for the Jump sound and nothing else, even if that sound is their favourite topic.
And if true, I don´t see a problem with it, it´s their gear and they can do whatever they want with it...
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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by Mooger5 » Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:35 pm

The Spriral track gets my vote. In 1977, that´s the work of a genius. The sequence alone ( Roland System 100?) is just other-worldly.
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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by Bitexion » Thu Apr 20, 2017 6:40 am

There is no ONE sound only the CS80 can do, it's just another polysynth when all comes down to it.

People seem to forget that Stevie Wonder was also a major user of CS-80's, both live and on records. But he didn't play slow brass sounds so I guess he doesn't count, then. Legend has it that he wore out the pitch ribbons all the time.

Another fun fact is that the last produced Elka Synthex went to Stevie Wonder, not JM Jarre.

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Re: What synth is used in the gold HQ scene in Blade Runner?

Post by el-folie » Thu Apr 20, 2017 3:06 pm

knolan wrote: My two project studio rooms totally disassembled - rebuilding both of them and taking forever so can't try anything for some months :-(

You are right - we've lost track of the original point. The sound you're referring to is the "Human Voice" tone available on the VP330. It's not the vocoder - the VP330 offers three facilities - Strings, Vocoder and that stunning "Human Voice" - Male and Female voices, 8" and 4", both an "Ahh" tone. Vangelis uses it to astounding effect in that scene - it's very much bathed in chorus and reverb. He uses it on Chariots of Fire, The friends of Mr Cairo, See You Later and numerous albums at the time. It's also used by Tangerine Dream to great effect on their album Hyperboria.

Vangelis get so much out of the VP330 because he layers them, and as said, bathes them in chorus and Lexicon reverb. But - his use of voicings and chords are what really nail it. He uses chords with 9th and 4th (11ths) to create great tension in that Human Voice sound; while when playing the VP330 Strings his chord progressions are very well crafted and imbues his string playing with tension, drama and 'life'.

The use of that Human Voice in that scene seems to marry perfectly with the lighting and mood set by Ridley Scott. But note the careful use of Fender Rhodes and other delicate instruments too - it's the fusion of them all that engenders the sound with a sense of 'light'.
Yeah, I know situations like that. At the moment I´m prepared to moving flats, so almost all the equipment is boxed up at the walls, ontop of cupboards or under the bed. Space is an issue here, unfortunately. And of course there´s no hurry in working out the brb patch on cs80/cs40m as we fans are old chaps now since hearing it in the early 80s and can wait as long as it takes ;) It also seems the ability to wait for something or to look forward to something is also becoming a lost art nowadays, when everything, well most of all information or goods, are just a click away. If you find the time & place to do the brb patch and let us synth fanatics take part in on how it´s done I guess for some it will be a little epiphany :)
Bitexion wrote:There is no ONE sound only the CS80 can do, it's just another polysynth when all comes down to it.
No, it´s clearly not just another poly synth and also not just another sound. Why? Because you can´t do it on any other synth without the same metallic filter sound combined with poly aftertouch and linear detuned oscillators. The patch is really something special, maybe easy to have on a cs80 but definitely not on any other random synth. If you technically talk about detuned saws, yes, if you talk about HOW it sounds, no. But if its sound doesn´t appeal to you, fine, I´m okay with that ;)

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