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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:02 am
by Kidney05
Cumulus wrote:
vox345 wrote:
Forget my OP then and let me simply ask it like this. Thanks.
Why would I possibly want an analogue synthesizer (disregard a synth’s actual tone that I might personally like or not, mixing or composition skills, etc. I’m just talking about the signal architecture) if I had a non-aliasing digital synthesizer and software elaborate enough to manipulate it in infinite/almost infinite ways to mimic analogue behavior? I’m just trying to understand the analogue craze. Is it ‘cause analog does all the work for you?
1. There may come a day when software can mimck analog circuitry so completely that it captures its whole essence right down to the sometimes unpredictable randomness that we love about our analog. If that ever happens then a good chunk of bandwidth here on VSE will free up.

2. Yes, analog synths do all the work for us.

I like to turn on my MiniMoog and plop my a*s on the couch with a pint of Haagen Dasz while it composes, performs and records a piece of music for me.

The newer Moogs actually post songs on the intranet and file copyright paperwork with the Library of Congress.
i've heard that at least 30% of pop music now is written by Moogs

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:07 am
by Mr. DiSco
Okay, I'm going to try to reply to you seriously for the last time. The less we can say is that you have certain problems with your interactions on this forum and I think you can be sure, you're the one who will have to make the change.

Now that it's said, I'm going to advise you to just try music gear instead of just coming here expecting people to tell you why you have to like certain features. Nobody's really here to sell anything, unless it's in the for sale section. Regarding analog, I may sound like a mixture of various posts from AutomaticGainsay, but it's only a ''way'' of making your sounds. To some it just implies a more physical instrument than the digital has ever got. I wouldn't talk about a more ''Quality'' sound coming from analog you can get just the same sound on a virtual analog instrument. You CAN but you most-likely won't because the way creativity works (at least for me) in an analog instrument is completely different than in a digital one. Now we could go on and on about the richer sound of analog, but trust me this would go nowhere, and since you've asked repeatedly about what justifies buying analog, I'll simply answer that the richer sound should never be that thing.

Now if you make your next post crystal clear and don't start another time insinuating all kinds of things that don't make sense as soon as you have experienced synths a bit, maybe this thread could evolve into a normal discussion here involving you.

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:08 am
by ApolloBoy
vox345 wrote:
That's all I got out of it. I'd talk more but my MG-1 just came up to me with a new song and wants to go it over with the JP-4. They can't do all of the work I suppose. *shrugs*

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:50 am
by bouzoukijoe1
GuyaGuy wrote:The most interesting synths out now are virtual digital.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
I can't wait to get my hands on the iVirus for the iPad, but it probably won't sound as cold as the original. I will have to run it through my Korg Radias to give it that real virtual analogue analog sound.

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:06 am
by Dr. Phibes
Cumulus wrote:I have a TR 808 that doesn't know how to separate the whites from the colors.
That's the main reason why I prefer analogue synths: they're not racist like digital ones.

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:28 am
by CS_TBL
In the end, it all boils down to this:

Image

Teh curer of all problams! :lol:

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:29 am
by Ashe37
you can't fight here, this is the war room!


Anyway, YES, you could 'make a digital synth' i.e. a virtual analog (hence the term) that accurately reproduces the behavior of analog circuitry. If it were a VST, you and everyone else would be complaining about the CPU usage. IF it were hardware, you'd be complaining about the price.... And the more 'modular' in nature said synth is, the more CPU it would consume because the less optimized the individual parts of the synth will be.

All of this has been discussed here before, extensively. Every time a new VA synthesizer, whether hardware or plugin, comes out, we've had this discussion. see: the discussion thread talking about the release of DIVA. (I'm not picking Diva arbitrarily, Diva has a really good circuit model and is a PIG on CPU)

If you emulate analog by 'adding harmonics' it isn't going to be a very good emulation of analog. That was essentially the old way of emulating analog, by faking the harmonic content of the waveforms instead of trying to accurately generate the waveforms...

And when the emulation is perfect, you'll complain because it emulates going out of tune.

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:40 am
by tekkentool
Softsynths can sound pretty "vintage" these days.

http://www.sonicprojects.ch/opxpro2/description.html

mmmmmm

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:06 am
by CS_TBL
Boy, is this video relevant!


There's a certain truth being told at 3:08 ..

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 12:34 pm
by tallowwaters
vox345 wrote:Take everything I say too literally, twist it around and try and make me come across as a troll/d**k/idiot.
On the internet, you are only represented by your words. When someone is banned for being an inflammatory prick and upon return, immediately creates a thread like this in the tone you've used, it doesn't take much 'twisting' for us to perceive you as a troll/d**k/idiot. Furthermore, it tells us you learned absolutely nothing from the ban, so keep that in mind.



vox345 wrote:I’d love for you to prove me wrong, that’s all I’m asking.
Prove you wrong? You've yet to provide any support for your wild a*s speculation. We don't have to prove a duck isn't a fern.

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 2:57 pm
by Ned Bouhalassa
How do you make an analog sound exactly digital? Sample it into an Emax II?

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 3:16 pm
by CS_TBL
Ned Bouhalassa wrote:How do you make an analog sound exactly digital? Sample it into an Emax II?
Sample it onto any digital medium.

The two core issues with digital samples of analogue sounds:
  • Some vampires who claim to still being able to hear beyond the nyquist frequency of the digital playback medium. I'm not so sure about all that, and certainly not within a mix. In any case, you may like this link to test your vampireness/dogness.
  • Aliasing when playing back at higher freqs, but basically that's where multi-samples come in
Other things like added noise, minor distortion, random fluctuations etc. are aspects of sound design (at least in my cookbook).

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 3:50 pm
by Ned Bouhalassa
I was being sarcastic! Maybe I should have used a :la:

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 4:26 pm
by zoomtheline
You can't replicate analogue as it's not a sound. Each analogue synth will sound as different from each other than a analogue vs digital synth. I have heard that one 303 can differ quite a bit from another 303.

Which one do you try and replicate?

Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 4:31 pm
by aredj
OK... Vox. The problem I'm seeing here, from your questions and such, is that you've obviously read alot about synths and such on forums or whatever, and are asking questions without really understanding what you're asking - I mean, you sort of do, but your grasp on the basics of what is going on with synths and sound in general becomes apparent - which is making your questions skewed and really difficult to answer (and obviously putting you in a place to get made fun of)

I'm reminded of a time years ago while skateboarding - a friend (a total newb) kept trying to kickflip down a set of 5 stairs... without even being able to ollie down them. He wouldnt take my advice to master the basics of what he was trying and continued the attempts, obviously destined to fail.

The moral:

You're questions are jumping the gun on your obvious experience. You're asking questions you don't (fully) understand. You can't learn this stuff by reading the internet and asking questions. This is pretty much why people are having at you... (that, and the fact that you're not getting the hints. I was 'there' when you got banned... you were being adamant about, well, you had no idea what you're being adamant about - or, you think you do but - no.)

Here's the hint. Play around, experiment more, and form your own opinions on what sounds good. DO NOT ask us why you should get analog. Get one, see how *you* like/dont like it... You canNOT do it any other way.

The ONLY reason I can *sometimes* spot an analog synth in a track, is because I've spent time with them and my ear is a little bit accustomed to the different sound. DIFFERENT.

No such thing as 'better' in the world of sound.