Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

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zoomtheline
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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by zoomtheline » Fri Apr 13, 2012 4:35 pm

^^^ yep, buy an analogue synth and see yourself.

Also I need to get out skating this weekend while the weather is nice.

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by Stab Frenzy » Fri Apr 13, 2012 4:55 pm

vox345 wrote:
Stab Frenzy wrote:
vox345 wrote:I’m told there’s nothing out there that can modulate a digi LFO or envelope to mimic analog’s behavior, so this is just about the sound/oscs then.
No, you've been told the opposite, repeatedly.
You said it here:
Stab Frenzy wrote:
vox345 wrote:it's like I'm saying if said digi lfo goes into audio range but is quality enough that we can' hear stepping falls/aliasing then it's the same as an analog except an analog has all those unpredictable and/or random harmonics and changes which should be able to be mimicked digitally to get the same affect. Takes some knowlege of what exactly to program, but am I on to something?
No.

People who are telling you there is a difference are being sarcastic. There is no such thing as "unpredictable and/or random harmonics and changes which should be able to be mimicked digitally" when you're talking about LFOs and envelopes.
Have another read of what I said. I'll expand on it so it's nice and clear for you:
I wrote:No, you are not onto something. You've missed the point of what people have been telling you.

Analogue LFOs and envelopes do not have "unpredictable and/or random harmonics and changes which should be able to be mimicked digitally", they don't have harmonics at all, they're modulators.
Some of the nicest modular envelopes (4ms PEG) and LFOs (Synth Tech E350) are digital and are much more capable than analogue equivalents. When you start talking about digital LFOs aliasing you're discussing getting into the 20kHz+ range. If' you're modulating anything, filter, VCO or what have you at 20kHz you're not going to be able to detect any aliasing in the modulator because whatever you're modulating will just sound like fuzz anyway.

vox345 wrote:I said “I GUESS the sort of things I’d add to the digi synth would be…” Supersaws sound ‘fat’ because of the added sounds. Added sounds are a main reason analogues sound ‘fat’/warm’. Minibrute has a sort of supersaw and many other fx/features and white noise it can spit out at once, MB is horrible mess?
[/quote]

In my opinion supersaws sound thin and fizzy. I've only ever used them for pads when thin is what I'm going for. The sawtooth animator circuit on the minibrute is unique for hardwired analogue synths so you can't use that as an example of analogueness.

I've haven't used one as they haven't been released yet, but I imagine if you turn up the sawtooth animator, white noise, sine wave waveshaper and filter feedback on the minibrute then yes it would sound like a horrible mess. Maybe you should try it out when they're available and let us know.

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by tekkentool » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:25 pm

The ideal supersaw is bright and loaded with treble, not "fat" (my god that term gets a whipping). They're also pretty much a 100% digital sound having been seriously popularized through the Jp8000.

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by cgren72 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:58 pm

vox345 wrote:
Zamise wrote:That would be cool if the DX7 or Nord lead 2 had digital outputs and that casio or whatever it is had a digital input.
Were you not told by someone most of the complex synth stuff you know, or did you sit around with oscilloscopes or whatever and PHDs in EE and figured this all out on your own?

.
I think everyone here learned from playing. Research wont help anything until you actually know what you are trying to accomplish. thats why people are making fun of you, its fun and you are trying to make it too serious.

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by Ashe37 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:08 pm

cgren72 wrote:
vox345 wrote:
Zamise wrote:That would be cool if the DX7 or Nord lead 2 had digital outputs and that casio or whatever it is had a digital input.
Were you not told by someone most of the complex synth stuff you know, or did you sit around with oscilloscopes or whatever and PHDs in EE and figured this all out on your own?

.
I think everyone here learned from playing. Research wont help anything until you actually know what you are trying to accomplish. thats why people are making fun of you, its fun and you are trying to make it too serious.
Playing plus a thirty-six week intensive electronics course (call it six hours of electronics courses per day five days a week for 36 weeks) in my case.

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by jaypodesta » Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:24 pm

Originally I thought you were a troll. Now I know you're a c**t.

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/electron ... logue.html

http://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthread ... taur_has_m

I couldn't be arsed with harmony central.

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by pflosi » Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:41 pm

http://acapella.harmony-central.com/sho ... y-analogue

There ya go ;)

Vox, as others have said, just get a nice analog synth and see yourself. You should be able to sell it again without much loss if you don't like it.

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by balma » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:27 pm

aredj wrote:No such thing as 'better' in the world of sound.
:thumbleft:
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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by tekkentool » Sat Apr 14, 2012 12:40 am

Vox.

Stop worrying about bullshit.

Go make some music.

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by Cumulus » Sat Apr 14, 2012 12:48 am

This thread has reached the pre-lock train wreck zenith point.

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by Sexor » Sat Apr 14, 2012 2:33 am

Next time I start a seriously misinformed analog vs digital thread, I'm also going to post it on all the other forums in existence in the universe, just to be completely sure that nobody on this planet can escape the vortex of my brain-numbing ignorance.
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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by vox345 » Sat Apr 14, 2012 4:13 am

Sexor wrote:Next time I start a seriously misinformed analog vs digital thread, I'm also going to post it on all the other forums in existence in the universe, just to be completely sure that nobody on this planet can escape the vortex of my brain-numbing ignorance.
I say in any of my analog question threads something along the lines of that what I state was mostly learned from forums and might be wrong or that I’m a noob with specs so bear with me (except for once I recall slightly misinforming on a non-music forum where the topic happened to come up. If I still had my account, i'd correct it but the damage was very minimal).

I don’t get what a lot of you are saying about experience needed to ask this question better/ know without having to ask. You can play synths for a lifetime and not know what’s going on inside to answer my OP.
Cumulus wrote:What do you want from us? A recipe? We don't have it. If you find a way to do it, please let us know. There are people on this board who would love to be able to perfectly simulate hat phat analog sound without paying that phat analog money.
I wanted credible conformation if the idea is possible in theory. I conclude it is but doesn’t currently exist because it would cost too much to pack all of this into a hardware synth. Also I’m under the impression that a VST would fall short on the high quality signal plus CPU that people use isn’t strong enough to handle all the elaborate and extensive modulation.

So, yeah, analog currently offers an exclusive characteristic and sound because it can’t be exactly replicated digitally.

My conclusion is correct, right?

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by Cumulus » Sat Apr 14, 2012 5:23 am

vox345 wrote:
Cumulus wrote:What do you want from us? A recipe? We don't have it. If you find a way to do it, please let us know. There are people on this board who would love to be able to perfectly simulate hat phat analog sound without paying that phat analog money.
I wanted credible conformation if the idea is possible in theory. I conclude it is but doesn’t currently exist because it would cost too much to pack all of this into a hardware synth. Also I’m under the impression that a VST would fall short on the high quality signal plus CPU that people use isn’t strong enough to handle all the elaborate and extensive modulation.

So, yeah, analog currently offers an exclusive characteristic and sound because it can’t be exactly replicated digitally.

My conclusion is correct, right?
I believe so. There will probably come a time when digital machines will be able to mimick the old analog circuits so exactly that Bob Moog himself wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

h**l, someone might be doing it now.

Who cares? If you wan analog then get analog. It's not something to be worshipped from afar and it's not even right for every application but if it's what you crave then save your pennies.

I know what's going to happen here. You're acting as if you get it but soon you will most likely say something stupid like "analogs do all the work for you".

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by tekkentool » Sat Apr 14, 2012 6:30 am

Just so you know vox, many of the qualities you may assign to analogue synthesizers are not always uniquely available to analogue synthesizers, nor are they always desirable. The only hardware I used in the creation of this song was my computer mouse

Would using an analogue synthesizer for the lead really make the song that much better? If it's what you like go for it, but what you use pales in comparison to what you do with it. The most important thing should be that it gets put down in the first place, not whether it sounds analogue or not.

If I had have played those parts by hand it would be very easy to create an "organic" sounding recording entirely with software, no it won't sound "analogue" (because it's not analogue) but you can still attain the certain qualities you want.

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Re: Make high quality digi synth sound Exactly analogue

Post by Sexor » Sat Apr 14, 2012 10:04 am

vox345 wrote:
Sexor wrote:Next time I start a seriously misinformed analog vs digital thread, I'm also going to post it on all the other forums in existence in the universe, just to be completely sure that nobody on this planet can escape the vortex of my brain-numbing ignorance.
I say in any of my analog question threads something along the lines of that what I state was mostly learned from forums and might be wrong or that I’m a noob with specs so bear with me (except for once I recall slightly misinforming on a non-music forum where the topic happened to come up. If I still had my account, i'd correct it but the damage was very minimal).

I don’t get what a lot of you are saying about experience needed to ask this question better/ know without having to ask. You can play synths for a lifetime and not know what’s going on inside to answer my OP.
Fair enough. My advice to you is to spend less time trying to figure things out on forums and just go and experience things for real. Go make music with whatever you have and have fun. You will find that all these things don't matter at all if you look at the big picture. ;)
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