Goog

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Bitexion
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Re: Goog

Post by Bitexion » Wed May 23, 2012 10:44 pm

Yeah but if they put out a review, and noone will be able to access the synth after today, it was kind of pointless.

Also, it's a really basic put together softsynth, nothing to review really :)

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Re: Goog

Post by dr funk » Thu May 24, 2012 12:21 am

Bitexion wrote:Yeah but if they put out a review, and noone will be able to access the synth after today, it was kind of pointless.
It's here: http://www.google.com/doodles/robert-mo ... h-birthday

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Re: Goog

Post by Bitexion » Thu May 24, 2012 1:17 am

Oh we can access it after today? That's good. Didn't get much time to doodle with it today.

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Re: Goog

Post by Stab Frenzy » Thu May 24, 2012 2:29 am

Did anyone else notice in AGs video that when he was explaining the third oscillator it was in fact turned down and we were hearing the second one, which is why changing the waveform didn't do anything?

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Re: Goog

Post by tekkentool » Thu May 24, 2012 2:56 am

http://g.co/doodle/2se9be

It's hard to play in time on this thing haha.

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Re: Goog

Post by space6oy » Thu May 24, 2012 2:58 am

not my doing but was shared over on muffs:
keep it real

Image

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Re: Goog

Post by Walter Ego » Thu May 24, 2012 4:34 am

Okay...so I don't own a Mini, so this is not an expert opinion by any means...but...with three saw wave oscillators and some slight detuning (no portamento), this thing actually has that unique buzzy but very metallic clanging Mini sound that is heaven to my ears. I haven't heard that come out of other VSTis or VAs. So, what I'm saying is...Geekfest for Google today and I'm pretty impressed. And it's also way cheaper than a mini. Free. Lots of fun. Kudos to Google, even if they track my every movement online.

Walter.

PS--Has this/will this cause a spike in Moog product sales?
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Re: Goog

Post by Bitexion » Thu May 24, 2012 11:18 am

Dunno if google has spent any time trying to "copy" moog oscillators and filters, or just used the most basic waveforms and lowpass filter design to make a subtractive synth.

Here's a comparison anyway:



Clearly the filter is way brighter and "nastier" on the Google one. OR it could be just higher cutoff setting on the doodle. Maybe they are sampled oscillators, who knows.

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Re: Goog

Post by Walter Ego » Thu May 24, 2012 4:14 pm

Here...this may shed some light



I'm not sure what "sampled oscillators" are; I've really never heard of them. It seems like they put together a real (if very basic) VA. And maybe it's not all that surprising that it sounds good (at least to my ears), because wasn't that part of Moog's genius--the simplicity of the design? Anyway, I'm still having fun with it today. There are some pretty monstrous (still musical though) sounds coming out of my computer at the moment. If it gets a new generation interested in the synthesis of their forebears, I say that's great.
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Re: Goog

Post by Bitexion » Thu May 24, 2012 5:06 pm

Well, you're quite right and wrong in a sense, but it would take an entire lecture on analog oscillators and filters to explain fully.

Let's just say that the oscillator waveforms on the minimoog are NOT perfect sawtooth, sine, square shapes, due to all the electronics surrounding them, and somewhat due to design. The pure mini saw in squashed and misshaped at the edges, making it sound different than a pure symmetric sawtooth wave because the harmonics change.
Most analog synths have their own "oscillator sound", due to waveforms being shaped slightly differently.

That's why most VA synths don't sound like a Moog. The filter is a ladder-type lowpass filter, also a very intricate design, which is why everyone speaks of the "magical moog filter sound". So just making a softsynth with pure digitally perfect waveforms would sound very unlike a moog. But you still get the usual detuned sounds of course. Also, analog oscillators drift slightly in tuning so you get a "thicker" sound when several are mixed together. Most soft/VA synths emulate this with some kind of "analog drift" parameter, that introduces a slight randomisation of the pitch every time you hit a new note. It's complicated stuff :)

This cartoon strip explains it best:
Image

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Re: Goog

Post by Walter Ego » Thu May 24, 2012 7:14 pm

Fair enough. No lecture needed. I chuckled at the cartoon. I get it about the waveforms too...I guess you meant sampled waveforms like lots of VSTi's use? Maybe...my knowledge in that area is very limited. For instance, in a VA like the Yamaha AN1X, is it a sampled waveform or is it a virtually constructed oscillator, like you might find in NI Reaktor?

That pretty much satisfies my curiosity. I will now go back to fiddling my knobs. Take that in whatever way you want.

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Re: Goog

Post by Automatic Gainsay » Thu May 24, 2012 10:57 pm

Stab Frenzy wrote:Did anyone else notice in AGs video that when he was explaining the third oscillator it was in fact turned down and we were hearing the second one, which is why changing the waveform didn't do anything?

If you'll look, there was an edit in there somewhere, and if you look at the octave settings of both Osc 1 and Osc 2, they are in the "LO" setting. And why? Because the volume knobs for each oscillator didn't work well enough to fully remove the sound of each oscillator. When I was focusing on one oscillator, I could plainly hear the others, even when the volume was all the way down. So, to combat this in the TINY amount of time I had to make this demo, I would turn the oscillators I wasn't focusing on all the way down, and THEN to the "LO" setting. The volume may be "off" on oscillator three, but it is still audible. The other oscillators are NOT audible, because of "LO." You're hearing the third oscillator.
The timbre actually DID change. The change isn't as noticeable as it should be because the Goog always has resonance on, which damages the nature of the soundwaves anyway.
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Re: Goog

Post by Bitexion » Thu May 24, 2012 11:50 pm

Oh yeah, I too noticed I couldn't make the oscillators shut up completely. And one time Osc 3 got stuck in key follow off mode, and the button didn't work. Oh well. It's a good analog emulation in that sense.

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Re: Goog

Post by Zamise » Fri May 25, 2012 8:12 am

Walter Ego wrote:Fair enough. No lecture needed. I chuckled at the cartoon. I get it about the waveforms too...I guess you meant sampled waveforms like lots of VSTi's use? Maybe...my knowledge in that area is very limited. For instance, in a VA like the Yamaha AN1X, is it a sampled waveform or is it a virtually constructed oscillator, like you might find in NI Reaktor?

That pretty much satisfies my curiosity. I will now go back to fiddling my knobs. Take that in whatever way you want.

Walter
AN1X uses "Analog Modeling" ;)

Virtual Analog soft synths use the same concept, the oscs are calculated for each sample bit keeping the same quality/rate while being pitched/frequency changed, sampled waveforms loose quality due to time streching the sample for pitching. At least that is my take, up side is more polyphony as the processor is freed up. A VSTI can use either method and others, but technically I think to be a VA soft or hard it won't be using sampled waveforms for OSC/Tone Generation. You can still have virtual analog control of it tho, confusing I know, and too much to debatable to keep discussing in a rational fashion. Lock worthy topics.

Wouldn't surprise me if Google used a pre-packaged soft synth creator like synthedit, I know it comes with a virtual Moog filter but how they got it on to a web page like that I've no idea, needs a full blown 16 track sequencer and vintage drum machine now :)
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Re: Goog

Post by masstronaut » Fri May 25, 2012 1:26 pm

Walter Ego wrote:PS--Has this/will this cause a spike in Moog product sales?
More likely a boost to Minibrute pre-orders...

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