Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

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Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by Tiger Jackson » Sun Dec 09, 2012 2:03 am

Where when you wobble the key with your finger it applies vibrato, here

Looks like a better alternative to a mod wheel thinking about it, able to use 2 hands without taking one off to reach over to the wheel

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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by Zamise » Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:51 am

MiniBrute can, but it is only mono with own sounds, supposedly can do poly if midied up but don't know if pressure sense vibrato on all keys if doing a chord like that, or if it would send those messages through midi which I'm not sure that would work like that either, I guess even if it did you'd also need an LFO for each key, or card, or voice on the external module it would be sending to, which would be pretty unusual, you probably couldn't ever sync them up, they'd always be reset each note. I'm not sure the CS-80 is doing it that way any way is it? I am assuming it isn't cause one LFO for each whole voice across all keys is the usual normal thing. Anyhow, I also don't think it is exactly coming from wobbling the keys, just can switch key pressure to vibrato which I'm thinking is how it is prob done on CS-80 too, but not sure. Wobbling your finger on the key just gives dif pressures, could probably just press harder or less too to do it. Can prob do it on many synths with pressure sensitive keys I'm thinking as long as you can assign the pressure to mod wheel and mod wheel to LFO. I Don't know how many synths can do that, but thinking my AN1X can also do ito, but prob not quite the same, pressure only sensitive with last key pressed I think, not 100% sure, and it isn't analog. Sure a lot more synths can do it too, but that is all I've got and know off the top of my head. I do know I've used that on the MiniBrute, can't say I like it better than a mod wheel though, it seems harder to apply precise amounts of vibrato with it and tends to go jump in vast amounts rather than being a smooth sweep in to vibrato. I'm sure it is useful tho in a different way as you will always start out with less pressure and go to higher/more vibrato, where as if the mod-wheel is already turned up it will already be in vibrato.
Last edited by Zamise on Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by justin_havu » Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:35 am

The CS-80 has poly-aftertouch, which is being used to control vibrato. What's cool about it is you can apply it to any one note in a chord without affecting any other notes, (the moving of the hand back and forth has nothing to do with it, he's just applying more pressure to that note.) Unfortunately, there aren't any modern synths that have poly-aftertouch, but AFAIK, a couple of Ensoniq synths have it (the VFX, and the TS-10.) The TS-10 is going for pretty big money on the 'Bay, but a VFX can be had for not a whole lot.
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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by GuyaGuy » Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:41 am

In the video he's just imitating the motion a string player would do to get a physical vibrato to demo the effect of after touch.

For true wiggling vibrato:

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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by Don T » Sun Dec 09, 2012 5:01 am

Some of the Yamaha combo organs of the same era have the same feature.
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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by Mac Moog » Sun Dec 09, 2012 7:46 am

I believe that I do that on my Yamaha AN1x, my Alesis Andromeda and the Ensoniq VFX SD controlling a DS PEK.

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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by Bitexion » Sun Dec 09, 2012 10:14 am

He's not REALLY wiggling the keys from side to side, he is pushing them further down, it's called aftertouch, and is present in loads of synths, more or less every synth on this side of the 90's has aftertouch keyboard.

Now, that being said, the CS80 has a rare form of aftertouch, polyphonic AT, where there is a little sensor underneath each key allowing for greater expression. Normally synths go for the cheap AT method, where pushing down one key affects all the keys at the same time.

Vangelis is a VERY heavy player, he said himself that he plays with his whole body, not just the fingertips.
I've seen him play a "modern" thin plastic keyboard, and he rattled the keys so hard you could hardly hear what he was playing.
He leans on the keyboard to apply aftertouch, so it seems like he's wiggling the keys, when he's really applying various pressure pushing them down.

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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by Ashe37 » Sun Dec 09, 2012 12:48 pm

Mac Moog wrote:I believe that I do that on my Yamaha AN1x, my Alesis Andromeda and the Ensoniq VFX SD controlling a DS PEK.

Not Polyphonically. OF the ones you listed, only the VFX-SD has Poly AT.

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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by vcs3 » Sun Dec 09, 2012 1:58 pm

Ensoniq TS-10/TS/12 also have poliphonic aftertouch:
http://www.vintagesynth.com/ensoniq/ts10_ts12.php
don't remember is the ASR-10 also as poly aftertouch.

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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by Ashe37 » Sun Dec 09, 2012 2:15 pm

VFX, VFX-SD, EPS, EPS16, SD-1, SD-1/32, TS-10 all have Poly AT.

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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by _seph » Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:43 pm

Ensoniq's SQ-80 also has it. I no longer have my mine, but the experience of it has left me wishing that all of my synths were capable of poly aftertouch. Such an amazingly expressive feature.

and for something completely different.... There is the upcoming QuNexus from KMI



which by itself is brilliant, but I am eager to see what affect it has on the market.

as for the TS-10 / TS-12; eBay prices are currently stupid, if you're looking for one check the Used section of Guitar Center's website. I've seen them frequently pop up there for very reasonable prices.
Last edited by _seph on Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by Bitexion » Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:46 pm

I have an SQ-80 too, bought it primarily for the poly AT keyboard. Great synth aswell though. It's so lovely to be able to accent a single note in a big chord, rather than accent all notes as you get with normal aftertouch.

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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by somebedroomdj » Sun Dec 09, 2012 5:38 pm

Ensoniq KT-76 has it as well. Not sure about the KT-88, but I would assume that it does.
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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by Casoniq » Sun Dec 09, 2012 6:14 pm

Casio CZ-1 and CZ-5000 also have aftertouch. I'm assuming my CZ-1 is channel aftertouch vs. poly. The manual does not explicitly state this, but I've found that pressing one note harder in a sustained chord modulates all held notes.

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Re: Any synths with keys like the yamaha cs-80?

Post by vcs3 » Sun Dec 09, 2012 6:22 pm

Casoniq wrote:Casio CZ-1 and CZ-5000 also have aftertouch. I'm assuming my CZ-1 is channel aftertouch vs. poly. The manual does not explicitly state this, but I've found that pressing one note harder in a sustained chord modulates all held notes.
Casio CZ-5000 doesn't have aftertouch neither velocity, could respond to velocity but I'm not shure.
CZ-1 has both but mono AT.

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