Korg MS-20 Mini

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Stab Frenzy
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Re: New Korgs

Post by Stab Frenzy » Fri Dec 28, 2012 2:19 pm

samuraipizzacat29 wrote:
Infrasound wrote:Does the idea of another VA MS20 give anywhere near the levels of excitement a potentially real analogue MS20 does?
anything patchable wets my whistle. I dare say I like the idea of an analog patchable digitally voiced synth better than an analog. Doesn't matter to me though as long as it plays nice with other patchable gear.
All those AD and DA stages would push the cost through the roof though, cheaper to do it in analogue. :thumbright:

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Re: New Korgs

Post by samuraipizzacat29 » Fri Dec 28, 2012 2:55 pm

multi-plexing! :D
-'twere a joke, I don't know how/if multi-plexed cv's work for anything. real cv, not just panel controls. That's actually something I want to proto - a mux / demux as a sequential switch. I'd like to do the same thing with a resonant filter bank.... I digress.....
edit: atmega328 has 6 inputs and cost around $2 so adding about 40 cvs would cost around $15. Then you could just multiplex all the panel controls and run all the cvs to a/d pins.

Alas, I know it's too far outside the box thinking to have immediate mass appeal. "mini ms20!" gets everyone all gooey instantaneously - self included. Contrarily "digital patchable monosynth" would alienate the majority equally as fast. I'm sure a few would :o and then ask "what all can it do? How digital is it? wavetables? samples?" only to be sorely disappointed. this is already better done in shruthi-land anyway.

anyway - here's to hoping this is for real and stays reasonably priced. There's plenty of documentation of me preaching cheap modular can be done. Something like this would help to put the power back into the hands of the consumer. we'll see.
Last edited by samuraipizzacat29 on Fri Dec 28, 2012 3:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: New Korgs

Post by haj » Fri Dec 28, 2012 3:05 pm

I need to search Japanese websites for leak info...although they're usually tight on NDA stuffs and I wouldn't bet..

I don't really believe it's a replica of MS20 (as mini MS20). I can't describe my reasoning in my limited English but from what I know about monotron/tribe series in Korg's dev, (reading and watching Japanese interviews, confs, meetings etc of engineers and director of them) I don't feel they will build a copy of something even if it's of their own product.

I have a real MS20. While it is a great synth and I love it, it is very limited to use for modular approach today. There's no osc outs. You can't separate ENV2 and sustain of ENV2 is very unconventional design. Some functionalities are not so useful. Like the momentum switch. Have you ever seen any REALLY interesting, useful usage of the momentum switch on anywhere in the web? I don't think anybody would appreciate the switch today if it works as exactly as original.. Same for the ESP (is it authentic in Legacy VA? I mean not the greatest ENV follower...) If they re-create MS20 clone, they would use V/Hz conversion rather than V/oct just because so it is directly connected to an MS20! Cuz they respect the MS20. And V/Hz is most unconventional today!

It's believable that they'll come up with something complete new, yet reminds of MS20, a full featured analog synth, and but not $500, more like $1000. Monotron and Monotribes must have been very good test beds and marketing reseach for them. In their interviews etc they sure talk about passion for analog and their legendary products but I've never felt an impression that they want to recreate the same products. No replica, no, even miniturelized, I don't think so. They speak of modern analog so the instrument is in the sense of that, not a revival.

But this "rumor" is proabaly a good sign of "something" might come again. My guess is more feature rich version of Monotribe. I don't know. But anyway I hope something interesting will come soon!

P.S. If anything comes, we've just got a national election and new Prime Ministar. Because of that Japanese yen is getting weaker very quickly now. This will certainly affecct the price of up coming product. For high or low, I'm not sure...

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Re: New Korgs

Post by silikon » Fri Dec 28, 2012 4:18 pm

Infrasound wrote:Other than DSI there's no-one producing real analogue for the mass market
Moog.
Elektron.
Arturia.
Studio Electronics.
Doepfer.
Analogue Solutions.
Vermona.
Sherman.
Korg. (monotron, monotribe)

...there are more (including modular manufacturers), some to a lesser degree...

I still believe that Korg's market for stuff like a mini-ms20 has been hashed and re-hashed in the form of VSTs and iOS applications. I understand the monotron/tribe and its form factor, but I don't understand rebooting a veritable legend and then crippling it with miniature keys, analogue or not. I know I stand in the minority here, but that doesn't equal win to me; and yes, I know just because I don't believe it to be so doesn't mean it's not reality, but at this point we're going on pure speculation and conjecture with extremely little to go on.
samuraipizzacat29 wrote:"mini ms20!" gets everyone all gooey instantaneously
...except for myself, apparently. Knickers - dry.
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Re: New Korgs

Post by bouzoukijoe1 » Fri Dec 28, 2012 5:26 pm

I agree with silikon. add MFB to that list as well, which in my opinion is still Korg's main "counterpart" in the analog world. if Korg is going to follow any "proven" model, it might be MFB (not even arturia or elektron) because they have already figured out how to design, manufacture, and sell decent analog synths at Korg prices (and Korg build quality -- yuck). in fact, I could easily see Korg rereleasing the MS-20 in an MFB-style package, like a Kraftzwerg. but surprisingly there is no MFB keyboard monosynth, so it will be really interesting if Korg jumps straight into a keyboard synth.

I feel it is unlikely however that it would meet any of our expectations. personally if they are coming out with a mini MS-20, my guess is that there will be a big catch. I'd be quite happy if they just came out with a desktop version similar to a Kraftzweg without mini keys. anyway, it's exciting to see what will happen next...

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Re: New Korgs

Post by polardark » Fri Dec 28, 2012 5:38 pm

Stab Frenzy wrote:
samuraipizzacat29 wrote: Doesn't matter to me though as long as it plays nice with other patchable gear.
All those AD and DA stages would push the cost through the roof though, cheaper to do it in analogue. :thumbright:
Well, a patch panel would be trivial to implement with digital tech. In that case, no audio signals would run through the patch cables, just timed pulses for detecting which inputs are connected to which outputs. That would, of course, completely remove the possibility of patching with other gear.

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Re: New Korgs

Post by samuraipizzacat29 » Fri Dec 28, 2012 5:48 pm

bouzoukijoe1 wrote:but surprisingly there is no MFB keyboard monosynth,
keyboards are generally too difficult to source and warehouse for small time manufacturers. It's one of those buy 1 and it's ridiculously expensive, buy 10000 and it's cheap sorta things. combination of cost, added complexity, and storage space makes it prohibitive for most small-scale guys. Also, small time analog manufacturers generally avoid programming (albeit unnecessarily) and so avoid keyboard scanners. MFB products obviously have some degree of programming, i'm just making a generalization. ha - it might be wise to avoid keyboard scanners and programming, because users request big time feature creep once there's a keyboard attached :)
silikon wrote:I don't understand rebooting a veritable legend and then crippling it with miniature keys
I suppose I'm taking for granted the stage / studio power users would opt for a midi controller, but I can see the point. I'm with you conjecture is fruitless at this point. Yet, I'm all hopped up on the idea of something fun available for a good price. I'm still after a minibrute when they hit the second hand market for a reasonable price (top side of never) but would like if they were just a wee bit more patchable.
polardark wrote:That would, of course, completely remove the possibility of patching with other gear.
then this conversation is moot because they would just reissue the legacy controller.

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Re: New Korgs

Post by Walter Ego » Fri Dec 28, 2012 8:20 pm

silikon wrote: Infrasound wrote:Other than DSI there's no-one producing real analogue for the mass market



Moog.
Elektron.
Arturia.
Studio Electronics.
Doepfer.
Analogue Solutions.
Vermona.
Sherman.
Korg. (monotron, monotribe)
Very nit-picky comment, but...

The only two mass-producers on this list are Moog and Korg. Maybe Arturia (though they are having trouble doing just that!). And I suppose Elektron are bigger as well. But most of those other companies are high-priced boutiques that serve a small niche market. Prices are high, especially from makers like Vermona and Analog Solutions because they're not mass produced.
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Re: New Korgs

Post by volumetrik » Sat Dec 29, 2012 1:05 am

redchapterjubilee wrote:I can't tell whether this is fake or not, but with Moog rumors firing up now too I wouldn't be spending any money on synths until after NAMM.
what Moog rumours?

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Re: New Korgs

Post by meatballfulton » Sat Dec 29, 2012 1:07 am

polardark wrote:Well, a patch panel would be trivial to implement with digital tech.
The patch panel on the MS20ic does in fact work.

Hmm, how long will this thread be by the time we know the real answer? :?
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Re: New Korgs

Post by sequentialsoftshock » Sat Dec 29, 2012 1:22 am

meatballfulton wrote:
polardark wrote:Well, a patch panel would be trivial to implement with digital tech.
The patch panel on the MS20ic does in fact work.

Hmm, how long will this thread be by the time we know the real answer? :?
13 or 14 pages minimum.

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Re: New Korgs

Post by polardark » Sat Dec 29, 2012 1:24 am

meatballfulton wrote:Hmm, how long will this thread be by the time we know the real answer? :?
Not that much longer than it is now. We'll all be tired of the new MS20 when reality catches up to it.

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Re: New Korgs

Post by Stab Frenzy » Sat Dec 29, 2012 3:45 am

polardark wrote:
Stab Frenzy wrote:
samuraipizzacat29 wrote: Doesn't matter to me though as long as it plays nice with other patchable gear.
All those AD and DA stages would push the cost through the roof though, cheaper to do it in analogue. :thumbright:
Well, a patch panel would be trivial to implement with digital tech. In that case, no audio signals would run through the patch cables, just timed pulses for detecting which inputs are connected to which outputs. That would, of course, completely remove the possibility of patching with other gear.
And what would be the point in having a semi-modular synth that you couldn't use with other gear? Especially an MS-20 with the ESP? :happy3: If you read the quote that you quoted you'll see we're talking specifically about a synth that
plays nice with other patchable gear.

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Re: New Korgs

Post by Stab Frenzy » Sat Dec 29, 2012 3:50 am

silikon wrote:
Infrasound wrote:Other than DSI there's no-one producing real analogue for the mass market
Moog.
Elektron.
Arturia.
Studio Electronics.
Doepfer.
Analogue Solutions.
Vermona.
Sherman.
Korg. (monotron, monotribe)

...there are more (including modular manufacturers), some to a lesser degree...
If you go back and read the sentence before the one you quoted out of context you'll see that the 'real analogue' comment was regarding polyphonic synths, which strikes all except SE off your list. :thumbleft:

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Re: New Korgs

Post by silikon » Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:20 am

Stab Frenzy wrote:
silikon wrote:
Infrasound wrote:Other than DSI there's no-one producing real analogue for the mass market
Moog.
Elektron.
Arturia.
Studio Electronics.
Doepfer.
Analogue Solutions.
Vermona.
Sherman.
Korg. (monotron, monotribe)

...there are more (including modular manufacturers), some to a lesser degree...
If you go back and read the sentence before the one you quoted out of context you'll see that the 'real analogue' comment was regarding polyphonic synths, which strikes all except SE off your list. :thumbleft:
Yeah, perhaps. My fault for not reading it a few times before replying. I wasn't trying to be smug, I replied as I read it. :truce:
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