New analog boxes from Korg?

Discussions about anything analog, digital, MIDI, synth technology, techniques, theories and more.
User avatar
pflosi
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 3620
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2007 6:14 pm
Gear: more than 150 characters...
Location: zürich
Contact:

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by pflosi » Sat Aug 03, 2013 11:59 pm

atlantida wrote:Some funny maths. If 2 Volca keys (3 voices) cost 150 USD each then a new Polysix would cost a little over 300 USD[...]
You're missing around four VCFs and VCAs in that equation...

User avatar
Electroluver
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 264
Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2008 4:54 pm
Gear: MS-20, M-500, Polysix, PAiA 4700, ROL309, C64 MSSIAH, JX8P, K2000J, SY-1010.
Band: DJ NAMELESS
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Contact:

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by Electroluver » Sun Aug 04, 2013 12:24 am

All of the boxes look awesome, though I'm partial to the beats and sub bass units. I have a polysynth for the chords and stuff.

User avatar
atlantida
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 56
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 7:55 pm
Gear: Yamaha: Motif ES-R, AN1X, CS6R, QY100
Korg: MS 2000-R
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by atlantida » Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:14 am

pflosi wrote:
atlantida wrote:Some funny maths. If 2 Volca keys (3 voices) cost 150 USD each then a new Polysix would cost a little over 300 USD[...]
You're missing around four VCFs and VCAs in that equation...
You know what "equation" I used? I projected it from the Korg Monotron versus Korg Volca Keys!
The Monotron's cost was about 50 USD for one voice, the Volca Keys has 3 voices for 3 times the money (3 x 50 USD = 150 USD) including new extra features so it's not too far-fetched what I stated, for a mini Polysix (since Korg likes it small, lol) with patch memory and additional features, they could make it for max. 600-700 USD.
Worked with:
Roland D50,JD800,XV3080,V-XT,MKS7
Yamaha FS1R,Motif ES R,CS6R,AN1X,AN200,TG500
Korg Trinity R,TritonR,EX8000,MS2000R,Radias
Novation Supernova 2R
Kawai K5000
DSI Mopho
Clavia NordLead1R
Ensoniq ESQ1,SQ80,MR

User avatar
Jabberwalky
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 2148
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 6:03 pm
Gear: A hybrid of vintage and modern junk
Band: Variar
Location: Pgh, PA
Contact:

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by Jabberwalky » Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:34 pm

Has it been determined that the Volca keys has 3 individual voices? They're not pulling a Poly800 and sharing 1 env and 1 filter are they?

User avatar
pflosi
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 3620
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2007 6:14 pm
Gear: more than 150 characters...
Location: zürich
Contact:

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by pflosi » Sun Aug 04, 2013 11:48 pm

^ Of course it's 1 env, 1 VCF...

User avatar
sourwookie
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 61
Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:40 pm
Gear: ARP Solus, Roland SH-201, Korg MS2000, Nord Electro 3, Volca Keys and Beats,Roland Juno D

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by sourwookie » Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:44 am

@ atlantida

I came up with these numbers quite a bit upthread but I'll repost them here. At the time I wrote this I was unaware of the difference between paraphonic and polyphonic--so my math here reflects production and sale cost of a paraphonic 6-voice Keys based synth with a keybed. As I understand now, the costs would have to go up a non-trivial amount to make it truly polyphonic.
sourwookie wrote:As far as R&D goes, the Volca Keys are real, do exist, and are out there already so I don't see any major additional investment there. Now, they sell to a Korg Dealer for $97 dollars wholesale. Most manufactures like to make a 33 to 50 percent markup on an item moved to wholesale. that means their cost per unit is around $65 to $75 bucks a unit. Let's be pessimistic and say $75. Now the keyboard I envision would have the workings of 2 Volka Keys. They could save expense by eliminating redundant I/O's and the membrane keyboards, but we'll leave that alone. So that puts us up to $150 in production costs for the guts of two Volcas. As far as additional hardware like a keybed and pitch wheel go, let's look to existing products like the Alesis Q61. It too sells for $149, and if we apply Korg's pricing structure to that we may be able to assume a production cost of $75 there also. That puts us up to $225. Let's just tack on a few buck more for additional features like keyboard scaling on the VCF or a pitch EG (don't forget--we now have two LFOs at our disposal). Let's then go to $250

Breakdown:
Volca 1: $75
Volca 2: $75
Keybed: $75
"goodies": $25
Production Subtotal: $250

Cost to dealers (net price=$250 X 1.5)= $375

In Music retail List price is usually twice net, so:
$375 X 2 = $750 List

And "street price" is commonly list less 30%, so:
$750 X .7 = $525

$750 list, $525 street price. Not bad for a basic, stripped down, six voice analog.
So yes, atlantida, it could be done for around your price, but that would be a paraphonic synth. Not as cool as a true polyphonic synth, but still usable.

User avatar
JSRockit
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 3911
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:15 pm
Location: New York City

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by JSRockit » Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:34 pm

It's sad that Korg couldn't deliver these on time.
Korg Volcas / 6 x TE POs / MicroBrute / EH Space Drum & Crash Pad

User avatar
Re-Member
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 316
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2007 9:44 pm
Gear: Juno-60, SH-101, TR-606, JP-8000, MC-505, CZ-101, DX100, DX11, R3, microSTATION, Monotribe, MS-20 Mini, SQ-1, Volca Series, Minilogue, Moog Theremin
Location: PDX

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by Re-Member » Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:02 pm

JSRockit wrote:It's sad that Korg couldn't deliver these on time.
What do you mean? They said these would be out during the Summer and there is still about seven weeks left in the season.

User avatar
supermel74
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 962
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:56 am
Location: Maine
Contact:

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by supermel74 » Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:04 pm

Re-Member wrote:
JSRockit wrote:It's sad that Korg couldn't deliver these on time.
What do you mean? They said these would be out during the Summer and there is still about seven weeks left in the season.
I recall a Roland rep saying July in one of the NAMM videos.

User avatar
Re-Member
Active Member
Active Member
Posts: 316
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2007 9:44 pm
Gear: Juno-60, SH-101, TR-606, JP-8000, MC-505, CZ-101, DX100, DX11, R3, microSTATION, Monotribe, MS-20 Mini, SQ-1, Volca Series, Minilogue, Moog Theremin
Location: PDX

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by Re-Member » Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:53 pm

supermel74 wrote:I recall a Roland rep saying July in one of the NAMM videos.
They've been out for about a month now in Japan, so that's still accurate. Since the US and UK are larger countries and probably have thousands of more orders, it makes sense that there would be a delay since it's cheaper to ship these overseas in bulk. The same thing happened with the MS-20 Mini. Japan got there's about a month and half earlier than any of the larger countries. But like I said earlier, people really shouldn't start complaining till at least after Summer.

User avatar
meatballfulton
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 5785
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2005 9:29 pm
Gear: Live 9, Logic Pro X

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by meatballfulton » Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:50 pm

Re-Member wrote:people really shouldn't start complaining till at least after Summer.
Ahhh, why wait? :drinks:
I listened to Hatfield and the North at Rainbow. They were very wonderful and they made my heart a prisoner.

User avatar
Cumulus
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1834
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:48 pm
Band: Cumulus

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by Cumulus » Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:04 am

Re PCM...The box is mostly analog but it has some PCM sounds as well.

User avatar
atlantida
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 56
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 7:55 pm
Gear: Yamaha: Motif ES-R, AN1X, CS6R, QY100
Korg: MS 2000-R
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by atlantida » Thu Aug 08, 2013 6:33 pm

sourwookie wrote:@ atlantida

I came up with these numbers quite a bit upthread but I'll repost them here. At the time I wrote this I was unaware of the difference between paraphonic and polyphonic--so my math here reflects production and sale cost of a paraphonic 6-voice Keys based synth with a keybed. As I understand now, the costs would have to go up a non-trivial amount to make it truly polyphonic.
sourwookie wrote:As far as R&D goes, the Volca Keys are real, do exist, and are out there already so I don't see any major additional investment there. Now, they sell to a Korg Dealer for $97 dollars wholesale. Most manufactures like to make a 33 to 50 percent markup on an item moved to wholesale. that means their cost per unit is around $65 to $75 bucks a unit. Let's be pessimistic and say $75. Now the keyboard I envision would have the workings of 2 Volka Keys. They could save expense by eliminating redundant I/O's and the membrane keyboards, but we'll leave that alone. So that puts us up to $150 in production costs for the guts of two Volcas. As far as additional hardware like a keybed and pitch wheel go, let's look to existing products like the Alesis Q61. It too sells for $149, and if we apply Korg's pricing structure to that we may be able to assume a production cost of $75 there also. That puts us up to $225. Let's just tack on a few buck more for additional features like keyboard scaling on the VCF or a pitch EG (don't forget--we now have two LFOs at our disposal). Let's then go to $250

Breakdown:
Volca 1: $75
Volca 2: $75
Keybed: $75
"goodies": $25
Production Subtotal: $250

Cost to dealers (net price=$250 X 1.5)= $375

In Music retail List price is usually twice net, so:
$375 X 2 = $750 List

And "street price" is commonly list less 30%, so:
$750 X .7 = $525

$750 list, $525 street price. Not bad for a basic, stripped down, six voice analog.
So yes, atlantida, it could be done for around your price, but that would be a paraphonic synth. Not as cool as a true polyphonic synth, but still usable.

Oh, I see; sorry for mixing paraphonic with polyphonic. :oops:
Worked with:
Roland D50,JD800,XV3080,V-XT,MKS7
Yamaha FS1R,Motif ES R,CS6R,AN1X,AN200,TG500
Korg Trinity R,TritonR,EX8000,MS2000R,Radias
Novation Supernova 2R
Kawai K5000
DSI Mopho
Clavia NordLead1R
Ensoniq ESQ1,SQ80,MR

User avatar
stich
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 23
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 4:18 am

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by stich » Thu Aug 08, 2013 10:54 pm

Sweetwater doesn't appear to make it clear that the units are not really shipping as of yet. Kinda lame if you ask me.

User avatar
Blue Monster 65
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1593
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:19 am
Location: down in the lab ...

Re: New analog boxes from Korg?

Post by Blue Monster 65 » Fri Aug 09, 2013 1:08 am

Quoting Sweetwater: Korg's new 100% analog drum machine, Volca Beats, is expected to begin shipping in September 2013. Pre-order activity on this item is guaranteed to be extremely high, so it is imperative that you place your pre-order with Sweetwater as soon as possible so that we can ship yours from our earliest possible shipment.

The Korg rep (not my former guy - some new, younger guy) told me he expected them to ship in July, but obviously the date was not for the States. They'll get here when they get here, I guess.
Muhahahahahahahahaha!

Post Reply