How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so many

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griffin avid
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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by griffin avid » Sat Dec 14, 2013 2:42 am

I go up and down and it's simply a lack of room- no matter how you set up your studio something will always be out of reach. And so, it's a constant rotation of the [current] favorite pieces. I say you're relatively young so there's really no need to purge yourself of wanting stuff.

I'd try and avoid the attitude of thinking my music will get better with more gear.
Other than that, you have a lifetime to pursue this and any other interest.

I do think it cures itself [a bit] once you learn yourself. You'll get a better idea of how you work and know if something is worth adding to your set up. If you're brand new to anything- EVERYTHING sounds and seems cool. A discerning eye and ear will let you know [fairly accurately] what to add, pass on and even subtract from your Want List.
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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by SynthFred » Sat Dec 14, 2013 3:31 am

In my experience, I eventually realized that I had two avocations. One was to make music. The other was to understand synthesizers. I found that to make music, getting deep with a few synths was what I needed. But to understand synthesizers, going wide and collecting as many as possible was the thing to do. Eventually, after understanding synthesizers, I could decide which to stay with and apply to making music. I did not have to feel bad about wanting to have so many, when I realized it was not driven by the need to make music. It was part of a parallel path of understanding the instruments. The listening board here in the forums is a good way to understand synths without having to actually buy them.

Another way to think about it is to look at the pioneers who had or have every synth. Obviously it is impossible to have 50 oscillators all playing at once, or even in sequence. It would be musically useless. So even they illustrate the principle that synth hoarding and making music are different things. I'm talking about Jean Michel Jarre's video showing all his synths, for example.



Now eventually, you might get to Jean-Michel's level and understand all synths so well, and make music so well. That would be fine! Kraftwerk, in comparison, decided to stay current, so they moved everything into the digital realm, where in my view the same principles apply. It is OK to collect. But don't equate collecting with making music. Keep only that which you need if you are not a collector.
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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by ppg_wavecomputer » Sat Dec 14, 2013 1:07 pm

SynthFred wrote: [...] Now eventually, you might get to Jean-Michel's level [...]
I hope I never will.

And if so, please shoot me.

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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by Hybrid88 » Sat Dec 14, 2013 1:44 pm

I find Youtube demo's have helped a lot, that and trying out in stores/friends gear. :)

Some people like to buy a synth to try and move it on later using the funds to try a new synth, that's a good way of doing it.

Some key points to keep in mind if you want to start a collection;

- Space is finite

- Money is finite

- Time is finite

- Priorities change

- Life is shorter than you think.

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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by Ned Bouhalassa » Sat Dec 14, 2013 1:56 pm

GuyaGuy wrote:You're young. Go out and experiment. Mono, poly, whatever gets you off. It's the 90s, man. Try Japanese ones, Germans, Americans, whatever. Stick your MIDI IN into the MIDI OUT. It's your MIDI. You can do with it what you want. h**l, CV your audio while you're at it. You're only young once.
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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by Solderman » Sat Dec 14, 2013 6:18 pm

Z wrote:If you find yourself visiting Dallas or have an extended layover at DFW, you're welcome to drop by my shop most weekdays: 11-4 and some Saturdays: 10-2 and check out the synths I have there...
I lived close enough that I took Z up on this offer back in November of 2008. I actually brought my laptop with a pro sound card and recorded the session, then came back four more times later the next year, doing the same. So I had recordings of my own playing style as a demonstration, in better quality than youtube to boot. Listening to these recordings repeatedly was very helpful in referencing my memory, like a journal. Most of those recordings can be found in edited form here.

For me it's about getting inspired while playing. If the machine is too cumbersome, whether due to complexity or malfunctions, and I can't make the music flow and also have a good time, then it's not for me.

What I found by going to Z's shop was that ultimately, you can find inspiration with just about anything if you know your way around it and the sound of it stays in your memory long enough for you to want to play again with new inspiration and new ideas. There also appeared to be some sonic overlap between all these synths, so the sessions helped narrow down which ones were more versatile but still inspiring. A machine that excels at only a few sounds or uses is revealed to be a luxury. This helped cure me of alot of my old gearlust.
I am no longer in pursuit of vintage synths. The generally absurd inflation from demand versus practical use and maintenance costs is no longer viable. The internet has suffocated and vanquished yet another wonderful hobby. Too bad.
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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by Tiger Jackson » Sat Dec 14, 2013 9:23 pm

Thank you for all the replies!
commodorejohn wrote:I strongly dispute the notion that "having your bases covered" in a general sense equals never having to be curious about other machines - a DX100 does not sound exactly like a DX7, and Lord knows this is even more true for analog gear. This is probably that old "minimal setup vs. maximal setup" argument rearing its head again...

That said, there is a lot to be said for getting to know and love the gear you already do have. I know I didn't appreciate my MS-20 Mini half as much before sitting down and doing a couple of tracks entirely on it - so many little nuances and tricks I learned just from doing that that I'd never anticipated when I first got it.
Is a DX7 with 2 operators off essentially a 4-op? Same sound and all. I find my DX100 fun to limit myself with 16 bit sounds with. May as well get the two extra ops if so.

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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by commodorejohn » Sat Dec 14, 2013 11:59 pm

Tiger Jackson wrote:Is a DX7 with 2 operators off essentially a 4-op? Same sound and all. I find my DX100 fun to limit myself with 16 bit sounds with. May as well get the two extra ops if so.
You can make a DX7 sound like one of the 4-op DXes (at least the ones like your DX100 without the extra waveforms that the TX81Z/DX11/V50 have.) The raw sound of one operator modulating another at a given level and frequency ratio is pretty much identical. But the real power of the DX7 series is in its more complex EGs (they use an arbitrary five-stage envelope like the Roland D-series or the Casio CZ series, rather than the 4-op DXes' fixed attack-decay-sustain-decay-release envelope) and the much broader selection of algorithms as much as it is in simply having another two operators. The 4-op DXes are great, but the DX7s have a whole other world of sounds that they can achieve in addition to what their lesser brethren can. Great stuff.

(Also, the DX7 keybed is just wonderful. Excellent playability, and quite sturdy.)
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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by Z » Sun Dec 15, 2013 1:45 am

Solderman wrote:
What I found by going to Z's shop was that ultimately, you can find inspiration with just about anything if you know your way around it and the sound of it stays in your memory long enough for you to want to play again with new inspiration and new ideas.
Back in the day, before I had a shitload of gear, just hanging around the music shops messing around with the gear there would spark some inspiration. This was before laptops and portable recorders, so I would definitely need to remember what I played and what kind of sound was used and try to make a close approximation of the sound with the gear that I had at home.

The invitation to check out my gear is open to all my fellow VSE'rs.
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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by Ashe37 » Mon Dec 16, 2013 6:51 pm

Hybrid88 wrote:I find Youtube demo's have helped a lot, that and trying out in stores/friends gear. :)

Some people like to buy a synth to try and move it on later using the funds to try a new synth, that's a good way of doing it.

Some key points to keep in mind if you want to start a collection;

- Space is finite

- Money is finite

- Time is finite

- Priorities change

- Life is shorter than you think.
http://home.intranet.org/~airyn/b5/audio/finite.wav

:D

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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by Pro5 » Mon Dec 16, 2013 7:45 pm

SynthFred wrote:In my experience, I eventually realized that I had two avocations. One was to make music. The other was to understand synthesizers. I found that to make music, getting deep with a few synths was what I needed. But to understand synthesizers, going wide and collecting as many as possible was the thing to do. Eventually, after understanding synthesizers, I could decide which to stay with and apply to making music. [/BBvideo]
Same here really! Having bought/sold so many synths really helped me understand them better (not just the basics of how to make a bass sound for ex but how filters, oscs, envelopes, pwm etc compared and to find what was best for me - along with how they feel to play and control, also important as an 'instrument' for me).

I aim to have just 3 synths on my A-Frame in 2014 and am close...

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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by Bitexion » Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:02 pm

I bought a whole load of synths used and new like 5-10 years ago, and they've all just stacked up in my apartment where I can't fit them all into one place, it's ridiculous, and I can't bring myself to even sell them..I have no idea how to sell a half meter tall modular synth for instance..I don't have an ebay account so noone will think I'm serious seller if I put it up there.

I mean, noone buys from a seller with 0 feedback and 0 previous sales, right?
I was more in the hoarder mindset back then, gotta try that and that and that, "omfg a juno-106 gotta get that!",
"omfg a korg ms-10 gotta get that!" etc etc. Then I got on my mind that I needed a real analog modular system and spent a shitload of money on that.

Sure I know now how to program both a DX7 and any analogue synth and everything in between, but it's completely pointless knowledge since I'm not a musician anymore just a regularfactory shift worker who hardly turns on any of the synths. Meh.

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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by Synthetech » Tue Dec 17, 2013 12:15 am

When I started using a DAW, I've found many VSTi's with astonishing realism.

I switched gears on collecting the real synths, sold some of my aging gear to buy a few decent MIDI controller keyboards like an Akai MPK 61.

I still have a MC-505, SP-808 and a Korg Poly 800 and will keep them for some time.
But everytime I get an urge for some synth on the bay, I usually wake up and realize my DAW can do the same sounds.. if not better and with more control, than the actual gear.
And it should! I've got massive CPU power compared to the 80's/90‘s.. it can sound just like a MonoPoly,a PolySix, an Oberheim or even Jupiter 8.

FM8 and even Sytrus replace the need for a DX/TX unit... but I'll admit I watch for a bargain pop up and not afraid to admit I'll buy up a bargain to play it for awhile, but sell it down the road to use the funds for other toys.
Usually I buy a new toy, then sell an old toy to keep things tidy.

It really is getting to the point in technology that the older gear is more for collectors than for daily music production.

VSTi's killed the Vintage Synth Gear (melody from The Buggles please...)

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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by commodorejohn » Tue Dec 17, 2013 12:37 am

I completely disagree. As someone who started with VSTs, the more I move into real hardware the less interesting I find software instruments. Part of it is just the more hands-on experience - even with parameter-access synths like my Matrix-6 or DX7, it's a vastly different thing to sit down at a keyboard and just play than it is for me to try and focus on one program on a computer that can provide a million different distractions, and with knobby stuff like my JX-10/PG-800 and MS-20 Mini, it's just tactile and absorbing in a way that software instruments will never be. (And yes, I've used CC mapping with MIDI knob/slider controller keyboards. It's not the same at all.) On top of which, as much as there may be no theoretical reason that a softsynth can't capture the sound of x hardware synth, there's only a very few actual extant softsynths that I've encountered that really give their "real deal" a run for its money. Even the digital synths - the Mk.1 DX7 just has a warm, spacious quality to its sound that no FM emulation I've ever heard comes close to capturing. I'd never even consider going back to software for the things my hardware synths can do.
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Re: How do you get over the feeling of wanting to try so man

Post by Synthetech » Tue Dec 17, 2013 1:10 am

I felt the same way as you about a year ago Commodore.

But DAW use has convinced me to adapt to new methods of creating music.
What changed my mind more than anything is the space I save and no more huge cluster of audio and MIDI cables.

I'd love to have the real gear, but it just isn't feasible since I'm not either rich, single or live in some huge house I can set it all up to dash in and groove on a free day or evening.. which isn't often.

I'm sure some vintage gear is going to arguably sound better than a VST equivalent, but not enough to convince me to deal with all the hassles to obtain or maintain it.

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