Choosing TR8 and TB3 over TR808/909 and TB303

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adekoyote
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Re: Choosing TR8 and TB3 over TR808/909 and TB303

Post by adekoyote » Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:04 am

To me it comes down to the professional, the prosumer, and the audiophile. The professional and the prosumer will gravitate towards the new gear that is modelled of the old gear. The audiophile is the user/collector who swears by the nuance of the vintage gear...not just because of the original...but also due to the construction methods...lots of people do not like the aira series because you cannot customize it.

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Re: Choosing TR8 and TB3 over TR808/909 and TB303

Post by Stab Frenzy » Sun Apr 12, 2015 2:51 am

adekoyote wrote:To me it comes down to the professional, the prosumer, and the audiophile. The professional and the prosumer will gravitate towards the new gear that is modelled of the old gear. The audiophile is the user/collector who swears by the nuance of the vintage gear...not just because of the original...but also due to the construction methods...lots of people do not like the aira series because you cannot customize it.
:lol: A significant proportion of the 'studios' of the collector types who say that old gear is better either listen to everything through headphones, run everything into cheap mixers or either don't have monitors or have their monitors set up in weird spots like at knee height on some shelves. This is about nostalgia for them, not about audio quality or customisation.

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Re: Choosing TR8 and TB3 over TR808/909 and TB303

Post by Stab Frenzy » Sun Apr 12, 2015 3:17 am

KBD_TRACKER wrote:
Bitexion wrote:That was exactly my point. When they made the albums back in the 80s and 90s, the gear was the latest and the greatest. It wasn't some cool hip vintage gear from 1965 that cost $40000. So naturally, modern producers and musicians use the latest gear that is available to us now.
Well,
the TB303 came up around 83.
theTR808 in 80-83
the TR909 in 84.

(Acid) House and techno developed from the mid-late 80s onward. So this gear was already a few years old when they started being used in the new electronic music.
OK, so they were using gear that was 1-5 years old instead of brand new gear. That's still closer to using new gear now than 30-35 year old gear. I don't get what you point is when you say this.
Also both TRs were sold around $1000 originally. That was a much cheaper alternative to what Linn or others mfgs did in these days. The 303 was originally sold around $500.

So one could argue that at birth of the house/techno era, the x0x boxes were not really state of the art, and that they were rather "economical" tools compared to much of the other instruments/boxes of that time.
You mean like how now the TR8 and TB3 are a much cheaper alternative to the TR-808 and TB-303?
Imo, where x0x boxes were the "greatest" is at what they were doing (which of course is sort of circular logic since they were precisely used for what they could do). But otherwise these boxes imo were neither state of the art or "top shelf" stuff.
Again, like how the TR8 and TB3 are neither state of the art or top shelf. Sounds like you've just done a great job of completely demolishing your own argument.

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Re: Choosing TR8 and TB3 over TR808/909 and TB303

Post by KBD_TRACKER » Sun Apr 12, 2015 9:02 am

Stab Frenzy wrote:
KBD_TRACKER wrote:
Bitexion wrote:That was exactly my point. When they made the albums back in the 80s and 90s, the gear was the latest and the greatest. It wasn't some cool hip vintage gear from 1965 that cost $40000. So naturally, modern producers and musicians use the latest gear that is available to us now.
Well,
the TB303 came up around 83.
theTR808 in 80-83
the TR909 in 84.

(Acid) House and techno developed from the mid-late 80s onward. So this gear was already a few years old when they started being used in the new electronic music.
OK, so they were using gear that was 1-5 years old instead of brand new gear. That's still closer to using new gear now than 30-35 year old gear. I don't get what you point is when you say this.
Also both TRs were sold around $1000 originally. That was a much cheaper alternative to what Linn or others mfgs did in these days. The 303 was originally sold around $500.

So one could argue that at birth of the house/techno era, the x0x boxes were not really state of the art, and that they were rather "economical" tools compared to much of the other instruments/boxes of that time.
You mean like how now the TR8 and TB3 are a much cheaper alternative to the TR-808 and TB-303?
Imo, where x0x boxes were the "greatest" is at what they were doing (which of course is sort of circular logic since they were precisely used for what they could do). But otherwise these boxes imo were neither state of the art or "top shelf" stuff.
Again, like how the TR8 and TB3 are neither state of the art or top shelf. Sounds like you've just done a great job of completely demolishing your own argument.
No I think you misunderstood (sorry if I was unclear). My argument was just a comment on the highlighted statement above. (I agree with what Bitexion is saying, but I would go even farther: imo these boxes were not even really the "latest and greatest").

What I was saying is that in the days when house/techno started to develop, the x0x boxes were already available for a few years, had more or less commercially failed in "conventional music markets", and that they were not technologically leading edge (in fact in those days the emerging digital tech WAS the new wonder and considered most "desirable"). Look at advertising in those days: realism in drum box and synth sounds was THE holy grail.

My point is that in those days the original boxes had no particular "aura" of exception. They were just seen as good tools for this new music (good in the sense of appropriate, effective, well-suited). Just like a theremin would be much more valuable than a classic guitar for SF film scoring.

The aura developed latter because of the success of this type of music, the resulting increased number of musicians producing this music, commoditization of these boxes (supply locked) with until recently, lack of credible alternatives, collectorship and maybe the role of forums such as VSE :mrgreen: ....

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Re: Choosing TR8 and TB3 over TR808/909 and TB303

Post by madtheory » Sun Apr 12, 2015 10:05 am

Stab Frenzy wrote::lol: A significant proportion of the 'studios' of the collector types who say that old gear is better either listen to everything through headphones, run everything into cheap mixers or either don't have monitors or have their monitors set up in weird spots like at knee height on some shelves. This is about nostalgia for them, not about audio quality or customisation.
Very true. For evidence look at the "How about some pics of your setup" thread.

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