Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

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Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by lava » Wed Aug 12, 2015 11:59 pm

I've come to the realization that I need step sequencers in my creative process, but would also like to get something that has keys too. Can you think of any synths with both? Preferably heavily-knobbed non-workstation type synths with analog or analog-modeled oscs.

- Korg Radias
- DSI Evolver/Poly Evolver
- DSI Pro2
- Elektron Analog Keys
- Yamaha AN1x
- Moog SUB 37

I'm sure there are many others I'm not aware of.

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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by meatballfulton » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:48 am

Arturia Minibrute SE and Microbrute
DSI Prophet 08, Mopho, Tetra (keyed sequencer)
Novation Bass Station II
Roland JD-xi, JD-xa
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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by synthparts » Thu Aug 13, 2015 1:06 am

I like step sequencers too. There's actually quite a few -

Jupiter-6 w/Europa upgrade
Juno-6/60 with tubbutec Juno-66 upgrade
Mono/Poly with tubbutec Modysix upgrade
Yamaha CS70M
Memorymoog Plus
Alesis Andromeda
Poly-800
JX-3P
SH-101
Pro-One
Moog Source
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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by Weirdofromouterspace » Thu Aug 13, 2015 9:28 am

meatballfulton wrote:Arturia Minibrute SE
Non-SE Minibrute as well. You can switch it from arpeggiator to sequencer and vice versa using sysex commands.

http://www.vintagesynth.com/forum/viewt ... =1&t=80607 (and the link therein)
http://forum.arturia.com/index.php?topic=84517.0 (and the links therein)

I'm adding this (yes, I did notice it was you, meatballfulton, who posted the first thread I quoted above ;) ) just to point out that you needn't buy the more expensive SE version if you want a Minibrute with an onboard sequencer.

The 'standard' and SE Minibrutes are physically identical except for the different optical appearance:
http://hackabrute.yusynth.net/MINIBRUTE/standard2SE_en.html wrote: Except for the external look, the only difference between a vanilla and a SE depends on a small string of commands written to the EPROM of the microprocessor. The hardware and the firmware (1.0.3.23 or greater) are the same. Therefore in order to have your machine behaving like a vanilla or SE it's up to you to send a short SysEx command to your MiniBrute.
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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by pflosi » Thu Aug 13, 2015 9:35 am

Prophet 6
Modulus 001, 002, 008
SCI Max, MultiTrack, SixTrack, Pro 600, T8

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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by Yekuku » Thu Aug 13, 2015 10:19 am

Korg ms 2000 has a motion sequencer , not exactly a step sequencer, that can modulate pitch and other parameters.
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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by lava » Thu Aug 13, 2015 6:02 pm

Thanks for all the replies.

WOW, did not know about that ModyPoly upgrade for the Mono/Poly. I sold my mint Mono/poly in 2006. Smacking my forehead now! The sounds I could be making now with that upgrade...

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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by SeventhStar » Fri Aug 14, 2015 2:01 am

pflosi wrote:Prophet 6
Modulus 001, 002, 008
SCI Max, MultiTrack, SixTrack, Pro 600, T8
Of the Sequential synths, only the Pro One and Prophet 6, have step sequencers. There is, the Pro 2, but that falls under the DSI brand.

Sequential Multi-Trak, Six-Trak, Max, Prophet 600 and T8 all have real time sequencers, no stepping.

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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by pflosi » Fri Aug 14, 2015 7:21 am

Indeed... Probably was only thinking of synths with keys and any sequencer.

Where's the line though, what constitutes a "step" sequencer? Being able to input stuff in non-realtime? Being able to access all stages at any time to alter single steps, X0X style?

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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by SeventhStar » Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:04 am

"Step sequencing is the antithesis of expressive musicianship. It's quantized, digital, robotic and precise. It's literally perfect, the logical conclusion of the geometric, Platonic ideal of electronic music." With step sequencing, timing and note duration is set by the synth (the machine's settings), not by the human hands striking the keys. With step, your fingers, just select what notes to play and in what order.

"As the technology was improved, these were replaced by hardware sequencers that could record the notation of every nuance of a real musician's playing." Real Time Sequencing allows for playing that is as expressive as a human musician playing on a traditional piano. For novices, or people with fingers that don't quite obey their brain consistently, quantize adjustments on some synths, such as the Multi-Trak, can help your Real Time Sequences sound more professional (I know it has with my own playing).

Above quotes taken from this nice description of Step Sequencing, versus Real Time Sequencing:
http://bytenoise.co.uk/Step_sequencer

This probably could be turned into another thread of its own.. Didn't really intend to hi-jack the thread, but should be useful info for people interested in synths with built-in sequencers.

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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by pflosi » Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:38 am

That doesn't answer the question. A definition of a technology cannot rely solely on the product of that technology, "playing a sequence" is an extreme case of equifinality. Also known as the fallacy of affirming the consequent. For example: if I realtime record a very sloppily played line with a midi sequencer and then quantize it to death and remove all velocity and aftertouch, did it just become a "step sequencer"? A "good" sequencer can do both anyways.

So, to the OP, are you looking for any sequencers or only strict "step" sequencers? If the latter, what's your definition?

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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by meatballfulton » Fri Aug 14, 2015 12:40 pm

More for the list:

Casio CZ5000, XW-P1, XW-G1
pflosi wrote: if I realtime record a very sloppily played line with a midi sequencer and then quantize it to death and remove all velocity and aftertouch, did it just become a "step sequencer"?

There's a lot of grey area here.

The ESQ-1/SQ-80 sequencer is real time entry only but can be step edited. If you record an empty sequence you can enter edit mode and enter notes by step.

The Yamaha Motif sequencer has step entry as an option, but no step editing.
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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by pflosi » Fri Aug 14, 2015 2:17 pm

Yeah, that's my point :thumbright:

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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by jaypodesta » Fri Aug 14, 2015 3:29 pm

Elektron Monomachine SFX-6

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Re: Synths with both keys and step sequencers?

Post by Zamise » Fri Aug 14, 2015 3:45 pm

1972 Step Sequencer feature :o :o :o
|
|
v
2015 Programmable Arpeggiator gimmick :| :| :|

One of my favs is on the Alesis Micron, fits the criteria except it isn't laden with knobs, mainly because it is compact and can have multiple notes on a step. I also miss the Roland MC-505's D-Beam controller. It could be used like a programmable arpeggiator except you played an arrangement up and down the scale by waving your hand instead of pressing notes and having the rest follow in a timed sequence. I suppose a knob or slider could do the same thing really, but well then you just look like a goof playing with a knob or slider.

Stepped Programmable LFO :evil: :evil: :evil:
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