hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

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princefan3
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hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by princefan3 » Tue Aug 19, 2008 8:01 pm

hi guys....getting some good results with my drumstation and a matrix 1000 for bass
they seem to suit each other...a little jp8000 in there and im nearly done...

would like to know of any secrets that people use to try and give the high hats
more emphasis in a track...

i often hear the straight forward hi hat going..then somehow its given
a new lease of life...are they doubleing the same rythm to give it that punch
whats going on...

thankyou. :?

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th0mas
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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by th0mas » Tue Aug 19, 2008 10:04 pm

I always had a problem with highhats, and I also never had a place to use high-pass filters. Then one day I high-pass-filtered my high hats and all of a sudden my chink-chink-chink was a nice tss-tss-tss and I've never looked back.

I don't know if it will add prominence, but try it. And you can always compress!

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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by GeneralBigbag » Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:13 am

High-shelf the other voices to clear a little air - a few db off at 10+ kHz will open things up for the more shimmery sound.
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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by Huppo » Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:20 am

I've had good luck applying a really short single delay/repeat with the original panned all the way to one side and the repeat panned to the other. I think this thing uses that technique.
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th0mas
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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by th0mas » Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:20 am

GeneralBigbag wrote:High-shelf the other voices to clear a little air - a few db off at 10+ kHz will open things up for the more shimmery sound.
heyyy, great advice, im going to use that - thanks!

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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by GeneralBigbag » Wed Aug 20, 2008 7:06 pm

Huppo wrote:I've had good luck applying a really short single delay/repeat with the original panned all the way to one side and the repeat panned to the other. I think this thing uses that technique.
Similarly - setting up an FX send to a stereo delay which has times on the order of 5 + 6 ms, and feeding a bit of each track you want to spread out into it. EQ to taste + to avoid interference issues.
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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by clusterchord » Thu Aug 21, 2008 12:58 am

besides highpassing, and generally cleaning the area where u want it to dominate, i find spacing/positioning is xtremely important. when u want a "dry" yet big sound of hihat. it must not be actually fully dry, it needs to be positioned at least a bit from the listener to fit the "sound stage", with touch of short room or ambi, usually with very low rollof, like 2.5kHz. i use pcm70 with great sucess for this. when in mix, trail becomes unnoticeable, i.e. it sounds "dry" yet somehow bigger n more musical. this is often true for most "dry" drum production.

another important element in making this work, is judicious use of good compression.. to simulate that sound had to travel thru some air (compression) to reach your ear. further away u wanna go, increase compression, lower the output level, increase send to room.. i use gssl clone for this for hardware, or if ITB, the URS compressor plugs.. set very conservatively. in general for me its easier to get distance/placement and "bigness" with lofi digital hardware like sp12 n emax, but more time consuming than ITB, so it depends on the type of project (and its deadline..).
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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by aeon » Thu Aug 21, 2008 12:32 pm

clusterchord wrote:when u want a "dry" yet big sound of hihat. it must not be actually fully dry, it needs to be positioned at least a bit from the listener to fit the "sound stage", with touch of short room or ambi, usually with very low rollof, like 2.5kHz. i use pcm70 with great sucess for this. when in mix, trail becomes unnoticeable, i.e. it sounds "dry" yet somehow bigger n more musical. this is often true for most "dry" drum production.
This is great advice in my experience. Using the right reverb you can make dry drums sound bigger, yet still dry.

I like using a room with very short decay or using only the early reflections of a space to give a hihat some air and size. I find that the VSS3 algo of my t.c. electronic M3000 is perfect for this.

Another thing to try is gentle excitation, i.e., enhancing the 2nd harmonic. This can add weight and presence.


cheers,
Ian

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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by ThinkTanx » Fri Aug 29, 2008 5:15 am

Yep, I concur with the short ambience/reverb tip. It's a great trick to give any kind of 'synthesized' sound a proper real-world-type place to sit, and just makes things easier to mix, in general. Just give it a moderate to healthy dose of early reflections, with minimal to no pre-delay, and a short decay.

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Post by MrHope » Sun Aug 31, 2008 2:10 am

I once read somewhere that Peter Gabriel got so sick of cymbals spoiling mixes that at one point that he just plain stopped using them at all.
I know that's probably not the answer you're looking for, but it worked for Mr. Gabriel for a while. :)

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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by pflosi » Tue Nov 04, 2008 4:34 pm

to get hihats sounding tight, u need first to place it right in the room (pan for left/right, eq for up/down, volume for back/front). with that and some nice reverb, u can already get a good mix. what i for myself really like is giving hats (and drums in general) more transients - for example with any enveloper (i use the logic enveloper for that).

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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by JSRockit » Tue Nov 04, 2008 6:40 pm

I've just started using high-hats again in my music and outside of high passing other tracks...I've started to add a bit of distortion to them as well...depending on the type of hat.
Last edited by JSRockit on Wed Nov 05, 2008 2:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by clubbedtodeath » Tue Nov 04, 2008 10:10 pm

Brilliant topic!

I do a variety of things to hi-hats. Such as

- Compression. Always. As vital as EQ.
- Pitch-shifting them up into their own space, or down to grunge-ify them. Works best with a 50/50 wet/dry mix and some feedback
- Chorus to widen the stereo image
- Cutoff on low/band-pass with plenty of resonance. Esp. shifting the frequency around
- Tape delay

Secondly, definitely clear out a space near the top end for hi-hats. I find my Nord tends to veer up towards the top end (or the Novation when it aliases), and needs a bit of EQ.

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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by Stab Frenzy » Wed Nov 05, 2008 12:38 am

It hasn't been mentioned yet and maybe it's stating the obvious, but paying attention to the dynamics of your hats can make a huge difference to how they sit in the mix. If they're all at the same level then you're just making them louder or softer with the fader, but if they've got a decent amount of dynamic movement then your ear hears the loud ones clearly and your mind fills in the soft ones, and they don't get in the way of the other elements of the track. I find programming hats on the XL-7 with the 16 knobs is great for this.

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Re: hi hats..more emphasis in tracks.. how too

Post by monkey11 » Mon Nov 10, 2008 2:56 pm

whack a delay on the hats which is quantised the the same beat as the hat being played. If you can have to delay sound coming through over the top of the played note you get a layered effect on the sound.

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