how do u record ur drum machine?

Discussions on sound production outside the synthesizer such as mixing, processing, recording, editing and mastering.
User avatar
TrondC
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1280
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 9:47 am
Gear: Machinedrum UW & Monomachine Mk2's
Korg KP3 & Zero 4
Band: Siesta Submarina

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by TrondC » Sat Jun 13, 2009 12:17 pm

Joey wrote:
novielo wrote:
TrondC wrote: takes forever to line up the audio in raper properly, but it works tho.
do you syncn with midi? this could help you alot for this purpose

I didn't realize you could midi sync rape

:lol: :lol: :lol:
this made my morning

that is obviously Reaper not raper....

User avatar
JSRockit
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 3911
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:15 pm
Location: New York City

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by JSRockit » Sat Jun 13, 2009 2:09 pm

TrondC wrote:
and JS:
I record with the outs of the ESX turned to ca 25%, the inout of the soundcard turned to the max, and then I can adjust levels in reaper later. I've tried recording the ESX turned to 50% and the soundcard turned down, but the result is pretty much the same.
Try turning the esx-1 up even louder. What bit rate are you recording at?
Korg Volcas / 6 x TE POs / MicroBrute / EH Space Drum & Crash Pad

User avatar
TrondC
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1280
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 9:47 am
Gear: Machinedrum UW & Monomachine Mk2's
Korg KP3 & Zero 4
Band: Siesta Submarina

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by TrondC » Sat Jun 13, 2009 2:33 pm

the edirol interface is set to sample rate 44.1, reaper I think is set to 32 bits.

User avatar
Syn303
Expert Member
Expert Member
Posts: 1400
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2007 3:46 pm
Gear: Quite a bit...
Band: Syn303
Location: UK
Contact:

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by Syn303 » Sat Jun 13, 2009 3:18 pm

TrondC wrote:the edirol interface is set to sample rate 44.1, reaper I think is set to 32 bits.
that sounds more than adequate for recording purposes. monitor your mixer input levels too, hitting 0db should be loud enough in reaper, try adjusting your outboard mixer levels, aim for -6db, this allows for headroom if adding effects.

as you are recording in the digital domain, remember any levels above 0db (clipping) will add digital distortion. watch the level meters on your mixer and adjust your instruments levels accordingly, so that the levels on your mixing desk remain at -6db (if adding effects) or 0db.
| syn303.bandcamp.com | soundcloud.com/syn303 |

User avatar
aeon
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 881
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2005 8:18 am
Location: a lily-pad in the pool of my mind.
Contact:

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by aeon » Sat Jun 13, 2009 4:54 pm

TrondC wrote:If there was a way to jsut enter song mode, then just mute all other parts, I would, but song mode just plays back each pattern as it is saved, meaning I'd have to save each pattern as just a solo of the part I want to record.
Ugh, that sucks!
TrondC wrote:I thought about doing this, but I just started recording the parts one by one. takes forever to line up the audio in raper properly, but it works tho. However, the noise from the esx outputs is quite noticeable, and it is getting rather loud. the noise-reducer in Reaper is not good enough (it cuts out more than just the noise, probably due to the noise being as loud as it is..)
Use of a quality gate/expander dynamics plug-in will take care of this.
TrondC wrote:I'm going to finish this one track and see how it turns out. If it is anything but remarkably better than the all-in one take-method, I won't be doing this so thoroughly again...
It can be enough, depending on your sounds and your composition, to do the following:

1. bass drum
2. snare drum
3. hi-hats
4. all else as a stereo submix
TrondC wrote:now, if only my ESX was a Machinedrum UW...the elektron song mode is brilliant and I think doing what I want would be a lot easier with one... *keeps saving*
Yep...and not only that, but you'll have very tight timing - better than most any computer setup driving things via MIDI.


cheers,
Ian

GeneralBigbag
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 852
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 10:16 pm
Location: Grad school

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by GeneralBigbag » Sat Jun 13, 2009 7:17 pm

TrondC wrote:the edirol interface is set to sample rate 44.1, reaper I think is set to 32 bits.
32 bits is the internal bit rate for reaper - what JS was asking was whether the Edirol is recording at 44.1k, 16bit or 44.1k, 24 bit.
virb.com/ookpikk

User avatar
TrondC
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1280
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 9:47 am
Gear: Machinedrum UW & Monomachine Mk2's
Korg KP3 & Zero 4
Band: Siesta Submarina

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by TrondC » Sat Jun 13, 2009 9:37 pm

GeneralBigbag wrote:
TrondC wrote:the edirol interface is set to sample rate 44.1, reaper I think is set to 32 bits.
32 bits is the internal bit rate for reaper - what JS was asking was whether the Edirol is recording at 44.1k, 16bit or 44.1k, 24 bit.
oh, in that case, I don't know. it does not say anything about that on the box.

this is what I found on the internet:

(from http://www.roland.com/products/en/UA-1EX/specs.html )

Number of Audio Record / Playback Channels
Record 1 pair of stereo
REC SOURCE switch = ANALOG: Full duplex (except for 96kHz setting)
REC SOURCE switch = DIGITAL: Recording only
Playback 1 pair of stereo
Signal Processing
PC interface 24 bits (24-bit operation is available only when ADVANCE switch = ON)

AD/DA Conversion 24 bits (linear)
* ADVANCE switch = OFF: 16 bits
Sampling Frequency
Digital output 32/44.1/48/96 kHz
Digital input 32/44.1/48/96 kHz
AD/DA Conversion 32/44.1/48/96 kHz
* ADVANCE switch = OFF: 32/44.1/48 kHz

beeing the technical noob I am, I don't know what to make of that :oops:

User avatar
Syn303
Expert Member
Expert Member
Posts: 1400
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2007 3:46 pm
Gear: Quite a bit...
Band: Syn303
Location: UK
Contact:

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by Syn303 » Sat Jun 13, 2009 11:07 pm

If your using ASIO drivers, the default is 44.1, 32-bits. You can set your sample rates in the edirol control panel if there is one?
| syn303.bandcamp.com | soundcloud.com/syn303 |

User avatar
JSRockit
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 3911
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:15 pm
Location: New York City

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by JSRockit » Sun Jun 14, 2009 1:39 am

I would shoot for 44khz / 24-bit trond...this will give you nice headroom to work with.
Korg Volcas / 6 x TE POs / MicroBrute / EH Space Drum & Crash Pad

User avatar
TrondC
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1280
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 9:47 am
Gear: Machinedrum UW & Monomachine Mk2's
Korg KP3 & Zero 4
Band: Siesta Submarina

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by TrondC » Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:53 am

Syn303 wrote:If your using ASIO drivers, the default is 44.1, 32-bits. You can set your sample rates in the edirol control panel if there is one?
yup, it's set to 44.1, but there is no control to edit the bit-rate
JSRockit wrote:I would shoot for 44khz / 24-bit trond...this will give you nice headroom to work with.
so 24 bits in Reaper or on the edirol? no bitrate control on the edirol..

and what exactly is the benefit of lowering the bitrate? exactly what happens to the sound when elevating/lowering the bit rate? I may not understand something here, but I would assume that the lower the bitrate, the ower quality of sound? is that not what a bitcrusher does? I just don't see why a lower bitrate would be benefitial..?
:oops:

User avatar
Syn303
Expert Member
Expert Member
Posts: 1400
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2007 3:46 pm
Gear: Quite a bit...
Band: Syn303
Location: UK
Contact:

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by Syn303 » Sun Jun 14, 2009 1:46 pm

TrondC wrote:so 24 bits in Reaper or on the edirol? no bitrate control on the edirol..

and what exactly is the benefit of lowering the bitrate? exactly what happens to the sound when elevating/lowering the bit rate? I may not understand something here, but I would assume that the lower the bitrate, the ower quality of sound? is that not what a bitcrusher does? I just don't see why a lower bitrate would be benefitial..?
:oops:
I don't know Reaper personally to use as a program, because i use Samplitude.

But in Reaper's preferences menu under Audio, i think you can set the sample rate, which would be normally 44100 (default). so if you change that to 96000 samples you will get 24-bit recording per channel (24/96). A 24-bit sample is more precise than that of CD at 16-bits (16/44.1).

However when you mixdown for burning to a CD it will be in 44.1, 16-bits anyway.
| syn303.bandcamp.com | soundcloud.com/syn303 |

User avatar
JSRockit
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 3911
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:15 pm
Location: New York City

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by JSRockit » Sun Jun 14, 2009 1:51 pm

Trond the way I understand it is that 24 bit gives you more headroom to work... and for those of us who suck at mixing, that is a good thing.
Korg Volcas / 6 x TE POs / MicroBrute / EH Space Drum & Crash Pad

User avatar
TrondC
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1280
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 9:47 am
Gear: Machinedrum UW & Monomachine Mk2's
Korg KP3 & Zero 4
Band: Siesta Submarina

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by TrondC » Sun Jun 14, 2009 3:41 pm

JSRockit wrote:Trond the way I understand it is that 24 bit gives you more headroom to work... and for those of us who suck at mixing, that is a good thing.
ok, I think I see ;)

will change the samplerate in reaper then.

btw, sorry for completely taking over this thread, it just felt natural to ask here...

User avatar
Joey
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 1885
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 10:13 pm
Gear: 18u Eurorack, Octatrack, Pro2
Band: BLUSH_RESPONSE
Location: Berlin
Contact:

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by Joey » Tue Jun 16, 2009 5:39 pm

TrondC wrote:
Joey wrote:
TrondC wrote: takes forever to line up the audio in raper properly, but it works tho.
I didn't realize you could midi sync rape

:lol: :lol: :lol:
this made my morning

that is obviously Reaper not raper....
well duh, but I thought it was funny regardless.

also yeah 24 bit is way better

i do 44.1/24 bit, i'd do 96 if i could but my computer freezes up playing multiple 96k files at once (i've done enough remixes where this has happened to me haha)
No one cares, no one sympathizes,
so you just stay home and play synthesizers.

http://wearereplicants.com

User avatar
TrondC
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1280
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 9:47 am
Gear: Machinedrum UW & Monomachine Mk2's
Korg KP3 & Zero 4
Band: Siesta Submarina

Re: how do u record ur drum machine?

Post by TrondC » Sun Jun 21, 2009 9:16 am

allright, again sorry for taking over this thread, but I still have issues.

(copy&paste from electribe-forums)

I've found my method for multitracking a performance like this with the esx. it takes forever, but it should open for a whole new mix:

my track consists of 7 ESX patterns and 2 Monomachine patterns.
What I did, was to make a blank pattern on the ESX to record each instrument seperately.
first, I copied the bassdrum pattern from pattern 1 and pasted as part 1 in the new pattern.
then, I copied the bassdrum pattern from pattern 2 and pasted as part 2 in the new pattern.
you get it from here. The new pattern consisted of 7 bassdrum loops, so I just wrote down the song progression, in this case: patterns 1-7 was to be repeated, respectively: 4,3,4,3,1,1 and 4 times. meaning I'd loop part 1 4 times, then mute it and unmute part 2 three times etc etc.
this took a while, but atleast this enabled me to have the seven variations of the bassdrum patterns recorded as one audio file (much better than recording each loop and copy/pasting them)

..it goes without saying this took a while (some 4 hours yesterday), but now I should be able to get what I want (a clean sound).

however, still two major concerns.
First, it's hella hard to line up the wav's so they sync exactly like they should. after moving the wavs around and adjusting painfully small things (like moving the loop 1/128th note further/closer to the start line etc), it still sounds a bit awkward. like there is applied swing with different swing settings on each part. so, still working on that.

the second concern, and this is a biggie, is that the noise filter in reaper eats almost the entire sample before it is quiet. As I have been multitracking this thing, this means I have 17 parts, all including the ESX noise. it's driving me nuts, as the only reason I've spent probably close to 15 hours now on this was to get QUIET recordings.

I think this means my ESX is on it's way out of my studio. I'll keep it for live shows, but if I can get enough to buy that damn Machinedrum soon, there won't be much use for the ESX, recording-wise.

anyway, if anyone has a solution on how to make the noise go away without filtering away half the original sound, I would be forever grateful. I'm on the brink of giving it all up now, which is crazy considering the insane amount of time I've spent on this.

if anyone has Reaper (Yatmandu, I'm talking to you ), I can probably send over the reaper-files if you want to have a look at what I'm talking about ?

please save my ESX from the inevitable fury I'm going to have to get out soon....

Post Reply