Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Discussions on sound production outside the synthesizer such as mixing, processing, recording, editing and mastering.

Re: Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Postby Mooger5 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:35 pm

Well I was sure everything was set to maximum. Have to use a flashlight to see the setting though. Anyway replacing the backlight won´t replace a new reverb unit. This one lacks the reflexions that swirl away.

But you know it´s kind of a connundrum. The studio where I used to work at had purchased a Lexicon 480. I returned there just to see how it compared to the 300. And they told me they were showing the final mix and the client had asked why wasn´t that costly reverb added to the vocals. They said it was there already and to prove it they muted the reverb and the vocals sounded dry as a bone. Apparently the thing sounded so transparent that it was mostly noted when it was absent.

And after listening to this demo I´ve been reconsidering: is there such a thing as 8-bit reverb?

Watch on youtube.com
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Re: Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Postby Mooger5 » Sat Feb 20, 2016 9:24 pm

Just to say I went an bought the TC M-one XL.

And connecting the TG77 directly to the WS might not be the choice, as the entire signal goes through the ADC with the FX balance done digitally. Using the mixer´s send and return is correct way to do it, yes.
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Re: Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Postby madtheory » Sun Feb 21, 2016 12:21 am

Nothing wrong with balancing digitally, but usually putting all parts of the arrangement through the same setting gives mud, especially if there are bass instruments. Send/ return lets you give each one a different position in the virtual space. Also setting everything to maximum is a great way to get mush, in the kind of music you're doing.

Getting rid of early reflections usually makes it more ambient/ spacey/ lush.

And yes, those old Lexicon algorithms do that inaudible thing :) IRs of them do it too! You don't need the original machine. There are some free ones around, IIRC "Big G's" 480 IRs are excellent.
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Re: Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Postby Mooger5 » Thu Feb 25, 2016 7:26 pm

The TC is great for adding the ambience I was looking for. Going to check the free IRs :thumbright:
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Re: Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Postby meatballfulton » Thu Feb 25, 2016 9:06 pm

Mooger5 wrote:is there such a thing as 8-bit reverb?


There were plenty of 8 bit delays in the 80s, but I can't recall an 8 bit reverb.

I think there are ones being built today, though.
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Re: Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Postby Mooger5 » Fri Feb 26, 2016 3:55 pm

I suspect the 8-bit reverbs of today are aimed at the chiptune market... and are just "regular" DSP reverbs with some bit reduction added upchain, which may not be the same thing as some 8-bit reverb designed from scratch, with EQ and companding done in hardware and all .

When that Alesis unit came out it was like the Ensoniq Mirage of digital reverbs, and it was 12-bit. Looks like even the EMT 250 was also 12-bit. I´m guessing it´s the low bit count that makes it sound so dense and busy.
Maybe it´s possible to emulate it just by routing the returned wet signal through a compressor to squash the dynamics ( and raise the noisefloor)? Never tried that. And of course EQ the thing to lower the bandwidth.
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Re: Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Postby madtheory » Fri Feb 26, 2016 4:26 pm

12 bit is already more than you need to get RT60 (6x12= 72dB). I'm pretty sure density means the number of simulated reflections? If you mean it subjectively it could be to do with bandwidth? Dynamic range does not affect bandwidth. Reverb, by its nature (reflected sound losing energy) works perfectly well with a low bandwidth. 10kHz is sufficient.

I don't know the EMT specs but it was designed by Barry Blesser, who is a genius.
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Re: Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Postby Mooger5 » Fri Feb 26, 2016 4:51 pm

I meant subjectively, yes. By "reverb dynamics", I meant some reflections sound louder while some sound quieter. I think it´s possible to emulate that Midiverb 1 business by using compression with a low threshold.
About the frequency response, SoS said the Midiverb 1 was 10kHz while the 2 was better speccd at 12k...
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Re: Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Postby madtheory » Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:34 pm

EMT 250: 12 bit with 2 bit shaper giving 15 bit, same as AMS converter. 16 bit internally. 12kHz bandwidth. More info in this cool thread. IIRC there's a long discussion about Alesis algos- a compressor won't do it! I still use a few IRs from those budget machines, and I have a soft spot for the Quadraverb.
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/high-en ... tiary.html
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Re: Which of these FXs for ambient/drone music?

Postby Mooger5 » Fri Feb 26, 2016 7:00 pm

Good results with the TC Hall (or any other type) -> Compressor (in series) so far...

The Quadra GT sounded alright. Didn´t like the cheap plastic buttons, prone to breaking, but the "press harder for faster scrolling" worked OK.

Thanks for the link.
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