Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

A forum for comparing two or more synths against each other. Also known as "versus" threads.
Syx
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 11
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:30 pm

Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by Syx » Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:56 pm

Hey guys,

I really need your help! You see, I'm fascinated with additive synthesis and have found two of the best options out there for utilizing this method of sound manipulation. I have found the Kawai K5000s (which looks and sounds AMAZING) and Native Instrument's Razor (again, pretty darn incredible) for such methods. The Novation SL MKII seems to be the perfect controller if I want to go down the NI Razor route. My problem is that I can't afford both.....but I am unsure of which of the two would benefit me the most in the long run.

I've got a feeling that the K5000s would win because I want to gig a lot and I want to avoid using a computer to rely on my sounds, num' mean? Yea........decisions.

I came here because you fellas (and ladehs) know ur shiz! You really do and I look forward to hear the great advice you will give me!

Thanks guys, you're the best!

User avatar
silikon
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1247
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2006 1:21 am
Real name: Ms. Jackson
Gear: Random bullshit with knobs and buttons.
Band: Year with no summer
Location: East.
Contact:

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by silikon » Wed Nov 23, 2011 6:02 pm

The Kawai route is surely going to be a more 'hardcore route' in terms of programming and whatnot. If you like the relative ease of programming in razor, go outside and catch a bus with your teeth. Programming the Kawai can (and will most likely) be much more challenging to get programmed like you want it, and also because of the inherent depth of additive synthesis, your focus and patience will be tried.

have you investigated any other additive solutions? Camel Audio Alchemy & Chameleon, Virsyn Cube (incredible instrument), etc... Razor is not the only path out there software-wise.

If you're going down the additive route, are you looking specifically for something there, or would a wavetable machine serve your needs?
echo 1 > /dev/awesome

Syx
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 11
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:30 pm

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by Syx » Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:12 pm

What are some good brands for wavetable synthesis?

User avatar
silikon
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 1247
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2006 1:21 am
Real name: Ms. Jackson
Gear: Random bullshit with knobs and buttons.
Band: Year with no summer
Location: East.
Contact:

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by silikon » Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:33 pm

A Waldorf XTk immediately comes to mind, as does the Ensoniq VFX. I have no practical knowledge of the Ensoniq, however. I do, however own an XTk, and the joys are immeasurable. It has quite a range of timbres it can easily produce.

I'm not trying to shy you away from the Kawai, I think it's a wonderful machine. I sold mine because it was a pain in THE a*s to program. :)

I found myself losing track of focus and spending more time in programming than playing; which is why I sold it.

...but if someone offered me a complete DK Synergy for a reasonable price, I would go back to hardware for additive in a hot minute.

I guess if you're more concerned with exploration of sound and not necessarily recording tracks, then diving into the K5000 isn't so much of an issue (at least my outlook on the subject) -- but if you are really looking to add some gloss to your tracks with some additive timbres, then really it makes more sense to go down the software route. And the more I think about it, both apply to software; additive is much better served with a full display to view all the partials and modulation parameters versus jumping menus and getting lost in the depths of the display just trying to sort out what you are looking for.
echo 1 > /dev/awesome

User avatar
meatballfulton
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 5941
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2005 9:29 pm
Gear: Logic Pro X

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by meatballfulton » Wed Nov 23, 2011 8:55 pm

Be careful before buying Razor...unless you also own a copy of Reaktor, you cannot save any of the patches you create :evil:
I listened to Hatfield and the North at Rainbow. They were very wonderful and they made my heart a prisoner.

User avatar
Alex E
Synth Explorer
Synth Explorer
Posts: 2238
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2006 12:07 am
Gear: Jupiter-6, Juno-60, Polysix, Emulator II, DX7, QX1, Arp Odyssey MKII, ESQ-1, Miami, M1r, Live 9, iMac MC309XX/A
Location: Anaheim, CA

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by Alex E » Thu Nov 24, 2011 3:16 am

The Ensoniq VFX is the s**t.
I had one for a bit and it sounded awesome. Easy to program as well. If you happen to be interested in wavetable synthesis, I highly recommend it.
soundcloud.com/vectron


Syx
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 11
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:30 pm

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by Syx » Thu Nov 24, 2011 4:34 am

Hey thanks for all the info guys! Hmmm well if I were to go a Waldorf, it would have to be a Q due it having 61 keys.

As for the difficulty curve with programming the Kawai K5000, if that's what it takes to get the sounds I've heard others get out of it, then sure, I'll do what is necessary I suppose.

Can someone show me the Q's versatility? Anything on YouTube?

Syx
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 11
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:30 pm

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by Syx » Thu Nov 24, 2011 3:51 pm

Hang on a moment, I could just get the Ensoniq TS-10 and be done with it, right?

User avatar
rhino
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 2611
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2008 5:00 pm
Real name: bill
Gear: keepers:
Kurzweil K2500x
Ensoniq TS-12
Yamaha SY-99
Alesis QS-8
Roland JD-800
Roland JX-10
Akai AX-80
Ensoniq SQ-80
Korg DSS-1
Moog Mini
Fizmo
Location: kentucky hills

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by rhino » Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:27 am

The TS-10 is a fantastic synth, but has no real additive waveform creating ability. You can import waves to become part of a patch, or even use upto 18 oscillators to create drawbar-like waves. All good, but nothing like the 256 harmonics on the K5000 (I'd skip the sequencer on the K5000w and get the K5000s with the real-time controls)
When the wise man points to the stars, the fool looks at the finger.
- Confucius

Syx
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 11
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:30 pm

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by Syx » Fri Nov 25, 2011 7:39 am

Argh, I can't make up my mind!

Thanks everybody regardless. I'm making progress because of your help.

;)

User avatar
gridsleep
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 200
Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2010 8:10 pm
Real name: Kurt
Gear: Das Vorlagengehirn
Band: Big Steam Horse
Location: the Hudson Valley
Contact:

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by gridsleep » Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:02 am

Get a Kurzweil 150. Two-hundred forty oscillators. One monophonic quarter inch output jack. What's not to love? Additive of the gods. Of course, you'll need an Apple ][gs to use the programming software (available for download from Kurzweil's web site.) Or you could write your own, which I am going to try, so the mind-bending additive power of the 150 can be tamed via a modern computer. The 150. Go there.

(PS--I also have a K5000W and Razor. I'm not knocking them. And a Korg DSS-1. And I am close to cinching a Casio FZ-1. Now, if I could just find a Seiko DS-250/310... Quick! Watson! The game is afoot!)
Nymph, in thy orisons be all my synths remembered.

Syx
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 11
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:30 pm

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by Syx » Fri Nov 25, 2011 7:16 pm

I've decided, wavetable it is. Thanks for everything guys!

User avatar
worstofthewurst
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2011 5:20 am
Gear: Fizmo, FS1r, Pulse+, R8 mkII, Evolver desktop, K5000, Blofeld
Band: Sprutluder
Location: Portland, OR

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by worstofthewurst » Sat Nov 26, 2011 12:32 am

Syx wrote:I've decided, wavetable it is. Thanks for everything guys!
If you're going for wavetable, why not consider the Waldorf Blofeld?

I own a K5000S and Razor. I appreciate the immediacy of Razor, and the design is pretty brilliant (treating components as harmonic objects), but I still prefer (by far) the K5000S.

Syx
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 11
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:30 pm

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by Syx » Thu Dec 01, 2011 1:48 pm

I'm tossing up between TS-10 or VFX-SDII. Which do ya'll recommend?

paulh
Supporting Member!
Supporting Member!
Posts: 28
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2007 12:23 pm

Re: Kawai K5000S vs. Novation SL MKII + NI Razor

Post by paulh » Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:43 pm

reading all of that , i'd consider alchemy , its a great additive synth and more . i have a k5000, razor, and alchemy for me for programability and sound id go for alchemy every time , love the k5000 but with out a software programer it's pretty poor to program.

Post Reply