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Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:18 am
by vuuv
haha, the TX was more "well the lately bass is cool, maybe I'll finally learn fm, and it's cheap!" but the jx+pg looks like a sure thing right now :)

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:40 am
by commodorejohn
Man, the TX81Z is capable of so much more than "Lately Bass."

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:58 am
by nathanscribe
Indeed. 4-op FM can sound really plasticky and rubbish if you program it sloppily, but with a bit of attention to detail you can get some surprisingly smooth sounds out of it. The only thing to watch for on the TX-81Z is the aliasing that taints some high-frequency elements in some kinds of patch. But there are plenty of good sounds in that unit besides the one or two famous ones.

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:11 am
by commodorejohn
Personally I kinda like Yamaha FM's high-frequency aliasing, it never sounds junky and can add kind of a spacey edge to certain sounds. But yeah, there is that.

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:11 am
by vuuv
I probably will still grab a TX at some point... I might wanna play with some fm soft synth first, though, since it's so foreign to me. A rackmount fm synth might not be the best intro for me!

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:18 am
by commodorejohn
Most soft synths don't quite capture the real sound of Yamaha FM (what I've heard from FM8 is pretty close, but a lot of others are more "almost but not quite,") to be honest. And I don't know of any that offer multiple operator waveforms like the TX81Z does, which is key to its wide range of sound for a 4-op FM synth...

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:31 am
by ninja6485
FM8?

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:48 am
by commodorejohn
Oh, can you? Looks like. I stand corrected, then.

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 7:20 am
by Dr. Phibes
PolyMTL wrote:X10 and 8P sure don't deserve all the hate.
I don't see too much hate for these two - nor should there be! I would happily take either if I didn't already have a KIWId Jx-3p. Even then, I've seen some great deals I've been tempted with. Although sonically I still choose the 3P over its successors there's not that much in it.

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 10:27 am
by nathanscribe
commodorejohn wrote:And I don't know of any [soft-synths] that offer multiple operator waveforms like the TX81Z does, which is key to its wide range of sound for a 4-op FM synth...
Just for interest: hardware-wise, 4-op FM with multiple waveforms are the TX81Z, DX11, V50 and TQ5.

I don't know of any of the 6-op hardware synths with anything more than sine waves, but you do get more algorithms to modulate the modulators...

The SY/TG FM units had way more than that, and at least the 77 can use its onboard samples as FM operators.

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 5:00 pm
by Pro5
well if you meant the SY77 also had more than sine waves to use with FM (like TX81z etc) then yes it does. The rom samples are of course a different thing but can also be used in interested ways in the 77/99 with that RCM thingy-mag-gig going on.
I don't know of any of the 6-op hardware synths with anything more than sine waves
SY77 is a 6op hardware synth and does, I'm a bit confused as you seem to be acknowledging that the '77 has more than just sine waves yet say no 6op hardware does? - not picking fault just trying to clarify for whoever's reading.

So - the 77/99 has more than sine waves for FM and that is NOT including any of it's PCM samples/wave rom stuff.

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 6:44 pm
by nathanscribe
Pro5 wrote:well if you meant the SY77 also had more than sine waves to use with FM (like TX81z etc) then yes it does. The rom samples are of course a different thing but can also be used in interested ways in the 77/99 with that RCM thingy-mag-gig going on.
From what I understood from when I had one, the 77's AWM waves could be employed in the FM algorithms. Correct me if I'm wrong. I didn't get that deep into the programming.
I don't know of any of the 6-op hardware synths with anything more than sine waves
SY77 is a 6op hardware synth and does, I'm a bit confused as you seem to be acknowledging that the '77 has more than just sine waves yet say no 6op hardware does? - not picking fault just trying to clarify for whoever's reading.
Yep, I was referring (clumsily) to the DX-era FM synths :)

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:55 am
by Pro5
nathanscribe wrote:
Pro5 wrote:well if you meant the SY77 also had more than sine waves to use with FM (like TX81z etc) then yes it does. The rom samples are of course a different thing but can also be used in interested ways in the 77/99 with that RCM thingy-mag-gig going on.
From what I understood from when I had one, the 77's AWM waves could be employed in the FM algorithms. Correct me if I'm wrong. I didn't get that deep into the programming.
I don't know of any of the 6-op hardware synths with anything more than sine waves
SY77 is a 6op hardware synth and does, I'm a bit confused as you seem to be acknowledging that the '77 has more than just sine waves yet say no 6op hardware does? - not picking fault just trying to clarify for whoever's reading.
Yep, I was referring (clumsily) to the DX-era FM synths :)
Yes the AWM waveforms certainly can be used with the FM, I was just clarifying that in addition the FM section alone has multiple (16 I think) waveforms to use not just the sine wave. So a bit of a beast really! :)

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:17 pm
by nathanscribe
Yep, 16 waves and more algorithms than the DX era stuff too. Two FM layers and two AWM layers per patch make it pretty epic...

More back on topic, I had an SY77 alongside a JX-10 (with PG-800) for a while. A great pair for epic soundtrack-style stuff. I've parted with both these synths now, but they are both bargains at current prices, especially if you don't mind tackling the depth of the SY, and can get a PG or similar device to work with the JX.

But yeah, they were too good for me, I like a bit of rough.

Re: Roland JX showdown: JX-3P vs JX-8P vs Super JX10

Posted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 5:33 am
by vuuv
welp i totally went and splurged and got a j3xp w/ the programmer and it's the best