Live 8 is announced

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Hades
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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by Hades » Wed Feb 18, 2009 3:03 pm

Stab Frenzy wrote: I use version 6 and I haven't noticed any problems with the timing of the midi signal to external devices but I have noticed that the midi clock out is very messy. Stuff slaved to it just drifts all over the place, but I've heard this was a particular problem with 6 and they were working on fixing it. If you're using Live as your only sequencer it's not a problem.

did you try using midi sync delay compensation ? not sure if this was already available on Live 6 (but I think it was), this directly affects midi clock sync signals that come from external gear which is slaved to Lives clock.

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by tunedLow » Thu Feb 19, 2009 7:51 am

Stab Frenzy wrote:I think he's talking about the Random, Note Length and Scale plugs that come with Live, and therefore work on Mac or PC.

I know what you mean though, you can't exactly make a step sequencer with all the features you'd want with the plugins in Live. And the flexibility of having something that interfaces with the APC so you've got direct step control without using the mouse can't be overstated.
Yeah, I'm a dumbass. But like you say you don't get the flexibility - those don't work the way I want them to, for example, I'd like to be able to select a group of notes but randomize only their order or have a remix feature similar to the Revolution's. Could also be cool to select notes and have their length set at random, or perhaps change at each iteration. Plus I just like the idea of putting them together myself. But yes, I'm a dumbass.

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by Stab Frenzy » Thu Feb 19, 2009 8:34 am

Hades wrote:
Stab Frenzy wrote: I use version 6 and I haven't noticed any problems with the timing of the midi signal to external devices but I have noticed that the midi clock out is very messy. Stuff slaved to it just drifts all over the place, but I've heard this was a particular problem with 6 and they were working on fixing it. If you're using Live as your only sequencer it's not a problem.

did you try using midi sync delay compensation ? not sure if this was already available on Live 6 (but I think it was), this directly affects midi clock sync signals that come from external gear which is slaved to Lives clock.
The problem isn't delay, it's that if you tell it to output midi clock at 120bpm what actually comes out varies between 115 and 125. As in 115 and 125 in the same bar.

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by Hades » Thu Feb 19, 2009 9:56 am

Stab Frenzy wrote:
Hades wrote:
Stab Frenzy wrote: I use version 6 and I haven't noticed any problems with the timing of the midi signal to external devices but I have noticed that the midi clock out is very messy. Stuff slaved to it just drifts all over the place, but I've heard this was a particular problem with 6 and they were working on fixing it. If you're using Live as your only sequencer it's not a problem.

did you try using midi sync delay compensation ? not sure if this was already available on Live 6 (but I think it was), this directly affects midi clock sync signals that come from external gear which is slaved to Lives clock.
The problem isn't delay, it's that if you tell it to output midi clock at 120bpm what actually comes out varies between 115 and 125. As in 115 and 125 in the same bar.
:shock:

btw, just noticed that somehow I missed 80% of the posts on the previous page.
sorry for reposting stuff already said (midi fx in Live), wasn't aware of all the previous posts. my bad. :oops:

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by JSRockit » Fri Feb 20, 2009 5:02 pm

Stab Frenzy wrote:
The problem isn't delay, it's that if you tell it to output midi clock at 120bpm what actually comes out varies between 115 and 125. As in 115 and 125 in the same bar.
That bad? Wow... which version?
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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by masstronaut » Fri Feb 20, 2009 7:01 pm

It seems to vary quite lot depending on what plugins are loaded, some make it worse than others, it can be quite steady. MIght be related to PDC, and also obviously the work the audio engine is having to do.

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by Stab Frenzy » Sat Feb 21, 2009 4:27 am

JSRockit wrote:
Stab Frenzy wrote:
The problem isn't delay, it's that if you tell it to output midi clock at 120bpm what actually comes out varies between 115 and 125. As in 115 and 125 in the same bar.
That bad? Wow... which version?
6.0.10

I'm also using a 002 as my midi interface and I wouldn't be surprised if the Digi Coremidi drivers didn't function as well as the 002 does when it's working with Pro Tools. I know the audio latency performance is much worse when using it with a third-party DAW.

When using Live to clock the arpeggiator on the V-Synth over USB it was still bad, but not as bad as it was with the 002 and XL-7. It might have been related to PDC and other things as masstronaut mentioned though.

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by JSRockit » Sat Feb 21, 2009 3:37 pm

PDC?
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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by masstronaut » Sat Feb 21, 2009 9:54 pm

It means the sequencer is suffering from Paroxysmal Dystonic Choreoathetosis.

(Also Plugin Delay Compensation)

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by MitchK1989 » Sun Mar 15, 2009 3:16 pm

If Live 8 DOES have bad midi clock out, the obvious solution is to just make your other piece of gear be the master clock instead of the slave, and live can sync to it.

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by tunedLow » Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:08 am

I haven't noticed this - I use a few external sequencers - the one built into the MEK, a frostwave fat, and a FR Revolution. For these I use Live as the master. I just did a quick experiment where using Live as the master I had the Revolution with a simple pattern 4 note pattern synced to it, fired it up and it stays audibly tight to the metronome. I could then let it play for a while and then arm an audio track and record a few bars and those are in time as well.

I'm using Live 7, with a 2496 sound card, on a 1st generation Mac G5.

Did I mention I got that Mac for free? My bros. in law moved away and we were keeping it at our house for him. A year goes by and he had no plans to come get it, so he agreed to just let me have it. He bought it off a gaming company that went out of business - it just needed an os and ram. It's got 2 2GHz procs and I put 4gigs of ram in it.

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by Hades » Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:18 pm

Live 8 has been available as a beta version for a week or so now from the Ableton website.
I went on private Live training for a week in London about 2 weeks ago, and the trainer was beta-testing Live 8 back then.
I definitely liked some of the new features.
the zoom function just for practical reasons,
and the groove engine simply because it's lots of fun. and you can totally abuse it creatively, which is always nice.
but it crashed a lot of times, and never for any particular reason, so I'm staying away from their beta-version for the moment.
when they finally release it, I'll be very happy to get it.

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by krushing » Wed Mar 18, 2009 12:41 pm

tunedLow wrote:I haven't noticed this - I use a few external sequencers - the one built into the MEK, a frostwave fat, and a FR Revolution. For these I use Live as the master. I just did a quick experiment where using Live as the master I had the Revolution with a simple pattern 4 note pattern synced to it, fired it up and it stays audibly tight to the metronome. I could then let it play for a while and then arm an audio track and record a few bars and those are in time as well.
Live's MIDI engine was rewritten for v7 though, the main reason being those timing problems in earlier versions.

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by Hades » Wed Mar 18, 2009 4:55 pm

krushing wrote:
tunedLow wrote:I haven't noticed this - I use a few external sequencers - the one built into the MEK, a frostwave fat, and a FR Revolution. For these I use Live as the master. I just did a quick experiment where using Live as the master I had the Revolution with a simple pattern 4 note pattern synced to it, fired it up and it stays audibly tight to the metronome. I could then let it play for a while and then arm an audio track and record a few bars and those are in time as well.
Live's MIDI engine was rewritten for v7 though, the main reason being those timing problems in earlier versions.
one of the things we did in my training was sync our 2 laptops together. both Live 7 (of course).
controlling the slave from the master was not at all a problem,
but tempo was terrible.
it was exactly like mentioned before in this topic : if the tempo was say 120, the slave was receiving anything from 110 to 125 or so.
I remember I told my trainer (who's been using Live since version 1.5) we'd just been discussing this kind of problems on a forum,
and he said he knew that some people who set up a group of laptops to work with Live together, use an external piece of gear as a master for tempo.
but then again, he also knew people that use 2 laptops with Live, and never have any trouble syncing...
in any case, even if not all setups have problems, it does seem strange to me that they can't fix anything as vital as tempo syncing :(

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Re: Live 8 is announced

Post by Shanesaw » Thu Apr 02, 2009 11:47 pm

Ah, this seems like the appropriate place to put this.

I upgraded from Live 6 to 7 about a month or so ago. Today I got an email from Ableton advising me to upgrade to 8 and also get Collision and Latin Percussion. At first I thought, "Great! How much is this gonna cost me..." Turns out that this upgrade is completely FREE and it's like a $317USD upgrade! I've never experienced this kind of treatment from any company.
K, gotta get busy.
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