wavestation expansion PCMs.

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Re: wavestation expansion PCMs.

Postby desmond » Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:49 am

jxalex wrote:btw, hilarious, that INtegra7 is really module which only has one benefit -- all the expansion cards inside ready for readout. :D :D :D no other benefits! Its operating system and build is really wacko way becouse of its apt to crash; :S


I'll stick with my XV-5080 then! :)
Surprised it's crashy though, that doesn't sound good...

jxalex wrote:But atleast it would make other fellows here the fun with expanded way as I have other things to contribute.


Sure. Actually I'm personally more interested as a technical exercise, than as a way to get new cards - even better, rather than copying existing Korg cards, the ability to put your own samples on cards and use those in the M1/WS.

Other people have had various solutions for this in the past, either commercial (eg Frontal Lobe/PCM Channel or the Zadok Sam1) or DIY using tools like PCMCIA Card Workshop (for the WS SR cards) and other things I forget from years ago).

Actually, I really should get around to sampling out all the Wavestation waves, and putting them in my XV-5080 for some nice Rolakorg sound combinations, the WS samples through the Roland engine... for my own use only, of course... :)
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Re: wavestation expansion PCMs.

Postby jxalex » Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:57 am

the integra-7 is just as it is -- the others say too that well it is okay for studio use, but not for live use becouse its crashing nature and other flaws. But I cant stand the crashing equipment not even in the studio, and it has just 1 stereo pair output.

about M1/WS ...there is no PCMCIA slot. Have someone dissected its format in public? And where are the tools about making that PCM file which is ready to put on the card?
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Re: wavestation expansion PCMs.

Postby jxalex » Thu Apr 13, 2017 2:14 am

Once there was for sale Roland JD990 module with description that it works with expansion card ONLY, but not with internal waveforms... Ehh? THere are another one who tried to hack it and to get its internal waveforms?
I suppose it is so, becouse I recognize that I got this kind of trouble (mostly about connections) while doing readouts from JV1080 and the PCM slot did not functioned quite right as original afterwards and made me extra repair work. Now its all ok again.

There is a simple way to modify the ROM preset banks A and B to the custom ones as they sit in a readable format in a ROM.


I have myself both XV5080 and JV1080 module. JV1080 module I keep becouse its buttons have the blinking function indicating the MIDI receiving activity on its parts in the performance mode, so making somewhat simpler the debuging workflow with arranging. In XV5080 the similar thing which shows which part is receiving commands is buried deep in the menus. Also in some other ways I find the JV1080 more efficient when I need to arrange, whereas XV5080 is for same things. (but of course, imagine all these XV5080 panel MIDI part buttons to blink every time the midi command is received in the performance mode when 32 parts are used.. like a christmas tree).
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Re: wavestation expansion PCMs.

Postby desmond » Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:22 am

about M1/WS ...there is no PCMCIA slot.


The SR is, it's different tech to the earlier M1/WS (this is all from hazy memory though)...

Have someone dissected its format in public? And where are the tools about making that PCM file which is ready to put on the card?


You'll need to google, I was involved in this stuff going on 20 years ago now...
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Re: wavestation expansion PCMs.

Postby jxalex » Thu Apr 13, 2017 4:24 am

well, which means that not so much chance of finding that software.
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Re: wavestation expansion PCMs.

Postby Rasputin » Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:12 am

Slightly off-topic, as I have no specific expertise with reading out any of these expansion cards, but I will say that given how few "hardcore" VSE expert contributors we have, I hope we can all lay aside the trivial differences and try to help each other bash out our particular pet projects.

If we don't do these things for ourselves and each other, no one else will. Good luck getting Korg to send you the expansion kit for the Wavestation, or Ensoniq/E-mu to send you a new PAL chip, or Line 6 to send you OS EPROMs and schematics, etc. As a general rule, no one cares about keeping legacy products alive (or upgraded) anymore except for the few of us, so I'm cheering on anyone that's trying to understand and document anything proprietary or forgotten.

More on topic:

http://web.archive.org/web/200305011319 ... wrkshppcm/
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Re: wavestation expansion PCMs.

Postby jxalex » Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:38 pm

totally agreed Rasputin.

Reading now the software. Well it just opens the new doors to a new era -- re-programmable PCM cards, and I hope there might be also possibility to make them for Wavestation A/D if possible after some modifications as there is written

"Many people have inquired about the possibility of using this program on the Wavestation EX and AD. I have been told that the format should work. However, a special adapter card must be designed to interface to the EX or AD since they do not utilize the same formfactor cards as the 01W series and WS-SR" .

But that card adapter is no problem -- I can do myself along with those reprogrammable cards.


... Desmond. it cant be said better than the Rasputin already told, what is about the legacy products. So, lets co-operate. :)
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Re: wavestation expansion PCMs.

Postby desmond » Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:36 pm

So how feasible is getting to the stage of having re-programmable cards?

Presumably, assuming the card format is reverse-engineered and understood, you would need:

- Software for converting a batch of pre-prepared samples into a file/image that can be written to the card
- Software for actually writing the card image to the card
- Card writing hardware
- Blank / reprogrammable cards.

What hardware writes M1/WS-type cards? What's the cost and platform availability of such hardware?
What's the cost and availability of blank cards of the type used by the M1/WS? Is this stuff even available anymore?

Or is there a possibility of using some different hardware, eg, using SD cards and an adaptor in place of the original cards, in a similar way that some people have adapted old samplers which only used floppies and so on?

The hardware requirements seem prohibitive and/or a lot of hassle, but if that stuff is available and inexpensive, then it might be more feasible, perhaps..?
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Re: wavestation expansion PCMs.

Postby jxalex » Thu Apr 13, 2017 7:19 pm

UPDATE: the PCM expansions readout succeeded.

What hardware writes M1/WS-type cards?

custom programmer SEMF jx2.1 with expanded support and modest requirement.
it can among all other functions read and program 8..32bit items with data transfer rate 3MB/s with ISA bus and future model with 5..8MB/s as PCI bus. ;)
It is all very custom made hardware for such tasks.
SO it is not for sale, nor available.
Almost nothing about this kind of trickery.

What's the cost and availability of blank cards of the type used by the M1/WS? Is this stuff even available anymore?


There are certain things money just cant get becouse of limited availability. No cards, nor the hardware for it.

Almost NOTHING is available! I just make it from the scratch and it is absolutely problem as I have solved it.
I make the cards myself. No problem. ANd still seeking some information, but these are just fine-tune details.


@Desmond.
You have many questions, so... in a short way to answer --
Nothing is keeping back and it is almost half way fixed. ALREADY. ANd all is almost done, just cards to make and all ok, all equipment is too.


ABout the additional card writing hardware and software which writes to the card how it is done it really depends on if I am alone in this race or in a group and there is limited time and energy.
If I have to do all that race alone and as I have many other things to do, then I choose DOS, and the programmer computer is with ISA bus equipped (as my programmer card requires ISA bus just now) and all the software I have already there which I made half year ago. So, over half of the work done instantly! Becouse by this choice of tools I have my own universal re-programmer which works up to 32bit systems and over 24bit adressroom. So everything is ready for reading and putting the binary files to/from card.

It does not work for users with laptops nor with win8 of course, but what about me and my interests?? I get 100 times in this kind of situation to hear "just use newer system", and almost automatic "no! we will not compile it to be working for such old system". So why I even should engineer the other solution to make usable for others too if I do not get adressed my own interests regarding to platforms or software from a INDIVIDUALS who make synthesizer accessory software even such small as JD990 patch librarian!!!?!
So, until the environment is inconsiderate and ignores my interests (which is about the older platform), then I wont bother to make it compatible to newer computer users.

(* OR did REALLY, someone, ATLEAST, somewhere adressed my interests too and minimized my workload by fixing the the bug in the JD990 patch librarian so that it works under win98se?
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=101048
No so far, and so it is extra another additional work to me, just becouse that software programmer was lazy who does not considered to compile it to be compatible!!! But instead of solution and bugfixes I hear something which totally ignores my interests).

Otherwise would be ok to take a effort to make the solution for newer computer users as well.
But it will be not done as my interests are not really adressed about software. ANd so, I have to also re-program to me my own JD990 patch librarian which actually WORKS under win98se too without flaws.
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Re: wavestation expansion PCMs.

Postby jxalex » Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:46 pm

desmond wrote:What hardware writes M1/WS-type cards? What's the cost and platform availability of such hardware?
What's the cost and availability of blank cards of the type used by the M1/WS? Is this stuff even available anymore?



Many things with this retro hardware is possible when it is about the expansion cards and RAM cards, PCM waveform cards when it comes to about making copys or readouts or even making RAM expansions out of the specifications... etc. and if there is no hardware then I do that hardware.

Still, how can I get time and energy for all of this if I have to do everything alone with everything which is in my interest, just becouse others say "no" and avoid?
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