Kraftwerk sample case overturned

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pricklyrobot
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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by pricklyrobot » Sun Nov 23, 2008 9:13 pm

D-Collector wrote:That is just low. LOW!
What do you expect from a guy who named himself after a shoe?
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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by nuketifromorbit » Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:09 pm

tallowwaters wrote:Nice to see greed lose again. If those Krauts want more money they can work for it like the rest of us.

What the h**l is wrong with German musicians anyhow? f**k Neubauten wanted like 50 f**k USD for their CDs at their show. Assholes.
Maybe they still have war reparations to pay? I have little or no problems with people sampling other's work and then taking it in anther direction, however I do believe that when one does so they should credit the source. Appropriating the work of others has a long history in the visual arts so naturally I think its a bit silly to go ape s**t over somebody sampling a 2 second snippet. That being said I think Timbaland is an asshole if he doesn't credit the original artists.
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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by tallowwaters » Wed Nov 26, 2008 3:00 am

Credit is credit is credit. I sure as h**l aint giving Nas credit for the hooks I lifted from his album, mainly because my songs are cooler. h**l, I wouldnt want my f**k name associated with half the clowns in hip hop, so leave me off the credits please. If people that consider Timbaland an 'artist' wanted to hear the song he lifted from me, I would slap em with a shovel for the sake of gene pool.
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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by meatballfulton » Wed Nov 26, 2008 4:48 pm

tallowwaters wrote:What the h**l is wrong with German musicians anyhow? f**k Neubauten wanted like 50 f**k USD for their CDs at their show.
Go blame W and Wall St. for tanking the dollar against the euro.
I listened to Hatfield and the North at Rainbow. They were very wonderful and they made my heart a prisoner.

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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by meatballfulton » Wed Nov 26, 2008 4:50 pm

xpander wrote:=D> free the samples!
Post that again after some #1 hit samples one of your tunes and you get nothing for it while the "artist" gets millions.
I listened to Hatfield and the North at Rainbow. They were very wonderful and they made my heart a prisoner.

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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by madtheory » Wed Nov 26, 2008 6:59 pm

Thing is, it appears that the guy DID clear the sample, but only the mechanical copyright, which is mostly owned by EMI. He did not clear the copyright on the musical work, which belongs to mostly to Kraftwerk, and their publisher. Very odd.

I think Kraftwerk may have a musical issue because even though it is a short sample, it totally makes the song work. But not many judges are musical!

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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by shakey_hands » Thu Nov 27, 2008 2:13 am

just to add some more fuel to this sample debate.
check out the kraftwerk song computer love, then play coldplay's talk.

yep those crazy germans really were/are fantastic musical influences
----------------------------- =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> -------------------------------

as for me i love sampling, i plan to do a lot moe in the future. however i am a musical in my own right as well, who writes original music first. somebody who needs to leech of another artist should quit or be punished. (coldplay acknowledge kraftwerk so no beef with them, but i dont think they pay them royalties so make up your own mind).

if you write something it is yours and you should be proud, which means defending it from hacks in genres you may hate. lucky for me i love all musical genres. :D

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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by Vxster » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:58 pm

shakey_hands wrote:just to add some more fuel to this sample debate.
check out the kraftwerk song computer love, then play coldplay's talk.
I think that was all credited and cleared before release.

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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by madtheory » Thu Nov 27, 2008 5:59 pm

Vxster wrote:
shakey_hands wrote:just to add some more fuel to this sample debate.
check out the kraftwerk song computer love, then play coldplay's talk.
I think that was all credited and cleared before release.
Your thinking is correct. But please, let him have his drama... ;)

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Post by diezdiazgiant » Sat Nov 29, 2008 12:50 pm

This just sounds like such patheticly jealous conciet to me, the whole arguement against sampling - to you honestly believe that you own an idea and concept. Especially in electronic music as if no one else has ever programmed the same patch or played the same notes to the same rythym. Boo f**k hoo, thats just as egotistical as the people who dont give credit.

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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by Johnny Lenin » Sat Nov 29, 2008 5:22 pm

Thanks, diezdiazgiant. +1

I agree with the earlier poster -- free the samples!

This whole notion of intellectual property is based on the fallacy that the creator of anything creates it out of thin air, by force of his own personality.

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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by madtheory » Mon Dec 01, 2008 12:17 am

Johnny Lenin wrote:This whole notion of intellectual property is based on the fallacy that the creator of anything creates it out of thin air, by force of his own personality.
I think you have it backwards. It's really a way of turning something intangible into something akin to a product (tangible) that an artist can earn a living from.

Perhaps, because so many people are now able to make their music somewhat tangible (via myspace etc.) that the perceived value of copyright has been reduced. Music hobbyists don;t consider themselves to be artists, and without thinking about it, expect artists to sacrifice their livelihood, by disregarding copyright.

Anyway, this Kraftwerk case is not unique. This kind of thing happens a lot. When you sample, you need separate permissions, from the publisher and the record company.

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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by pricklyrobot » Mon Dec 01, 2008 1:55 am

madtheory wrote:
Johnny Lenin wrote:This whole notion of intellectual property is based on the fallacy that the creator of anything creates it out of thin air, by force of his own personality.
I think you have it backwards. It's really a way of turning something intangible into something akin to a product (tangible) that an artist can earn a living from.

Perhaps, because so many people are now able to make their music somewhat tangible (via myspace etc.) that the perceived value of copyright has been reduced. Music hobbyists don;t consider themselves to be artists, and without thinking about it, expect artists to sacrifice their livelihood, by disregarding copyright.
Exactly!

Certainly all art builds on what came before; there's nothing new under the sun, et cetera. You can make a case that copyright goes too far in some cases, or that copyright law needs to be re-tooled for the modern era.

But without copyright the whole concept of the professional artist can't really exist (what is an artist's incentive to make anything—leaving aside the purely aesthetic impulse to create—if he has no claim of ownership over what he makes), unless you want to go back to the patronage system.
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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by Johnny Lenin » Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:05 am

With all due respect, as much as I would like to discuss this, I think I'll step back. PM me if you'd like to discuss it further.

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Re: Kraftwerk sample case overturned

Post by madtheory » Mon Dec 01, 2008 10:41 am

Johnny Lenin wrote:With all due respect, as much as I would like to discuss this, I think I'll step back. PM me if you'd like to discuss it further.
No thanks.

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