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MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:52 pm
by winningatlife
Hey -

So I've been working on a MIDI Setup - I'm trying to find a MIDI Patch Bay that I can configure with OS X 10.5.7? I have a Midisport 8x8/s but it doesn't seem to work... at all.

Additionally, I've been trying to send sysex code (message) to a device (through a different interface), but the only program I've found is Sysex Librarian which only offers Recording and Dumping of whole Sysex codes - not the capability to send Sysex messages.

Are there MIDI controllers that can be programmed to send Sysex? I'd like to eliminate computers from the set up process.

Any MIDI Patch bays that are configurable without a computer?

Anybody have any ideas here?

-Ryan

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:57 pm
by aredj
The only midi controller I know of (which does not include everything by any means), that does not need a computer editor to input sysex strings, is the novation SL.
The BCR2000 has the ability to 'learn' sysex strings but I've not had great success with that. It works sometimes. You can program with a pc/mac editor.

A motu midi timepiece is a great stand alone midi router. And since you want to use it stand alone, you can pick up an old parallel port version for super cheap.

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:58 pm
by nathanscribe
I use a MOTU Midi Express 128, on OSX 10.4.9, and it's fine.

As for Sysex, I've had trouble finding something that will send short Sysex messages, or allow me to enter and send Sysex. Cubase is impenetrable and utter c**p, Sysex Librarian will not allow you to enter code to send, and doesn't like very short messages. I gave up in the end.

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 9:29 pm
by winningatlife
aredj wrote:The only midi controller I know of (which does not include everything by any means), that does not need a computer editor to input sysex strings, is the novation SL.
The BCR2000 has the ability to 'learn' sysex strings but I've not had great success with that. It works sometimes. You can program with a pc/mac editor.
Novation SL eh? Yeah, I've looked into those. The problem is I need to actually program short strings of SYSEX without the ability to output them from anything (if that makes sense). I am adding some comprehensive MIDI Control to a Juno 60 via a CHD Elektroservis MDCB, and a lot of the parameters are sysex-configurable only.

Is this something you've been able to accomplish?

On the BCR2000, was the difficulty programming the knobs or in the dependability once programmed? I'm concerned because a lot of the parameters I'd program would be "1" equals on and "2-127" equal off - making a knob less than ideal. Or even worse, "1" = parameter A, "2" = parameter B, and "3-127" equals off.

Luckily my device comes with a SysEx message generator, but, I have nothing to program with these messages.

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 11:43 pm
by Altitude
The novation stuff will work perfectly for what you are looking to do, the buttons can have all sorts of different states so you can increment, toggle, one shot etc.

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 12:51 am
by aredj
winningatlife wrote: On the BCR2000, was the difficulty programming the knobs or in the dependability once programmed?
Concerning sysex, the buttons and knobs are programmed with a computer editor only (3rd party - Behringer editor blows). Without a computer, the BCR boasts a 'learn' mode, which does understand sysex, but I've had mixed results. Mostly shitty ones.

But once programmed, it works great.
winningatlife wrote:The problem is I need to actually program short strings of SYSEX without the ability to output them from anything (if that makes sense).
Not to me 8)

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:02 pm
by winningatlife
aredj wrote:
winningatlife wrote: On the BCR2000, was the difficulty programming the knobs or in the dependability once programmed?
Concerning sysex, the buttons and knobs are programmed with a computer editor only (3rd party - Behringer editor blows). Without a computer, the BCR boasts a 'learn' mode, which does understand sysex, but I've had mixed results. Mostly shitty ones.

But once programmed, it works great.
That sounds pretty good. I've looked into the BCR Programming, specifically the BCManager (http://mntn-utils.110mb.com/index.php?p=1_5). This seems like a pretty sweet deal.

I also like encore electronics box, but only 8 real knobs (although a dozen or so patch sets) is a bit limiting.

http://www.encoreelectronics.com/cont_knob1.html
aredj wrote:
winningatlife wrote:The problem is I need to actually program short strings of SYSEX without the ability to output them from anything (if that makes sense).
Not to me 8)
I guess technically I could use something like Midi-OX to output the sysex messages to allow for a 'learn' function, I didn't think about it that way.

This may be turning into a versus thread.... BCR2000 vs. Novation Remote SL vs. Encore Electronics Knobby vs. CME Bitstream 3x. In fact... I think I'll make one!

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 6:08 pm
by winningatlife
nathanscribe wrote: As for Sysex, I've had trouble finding something that will send short Sysex messages, or allow me to enter and send Sysex. Cubase is impenetrable and utter c**p, Sysex Librarian will not allow you to enter code to send, and doesn't like very short messages. I gave up in the end.
I gave up as well in this aspect. Ended up installing Windows XP in VMWare Fusion, then installing MIDI-OX and Sonar 8.

Doesn't look like anything really is out there for OS X.

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 6:24 pm
by pflosi
your midisport 8x8 can work without computer. search for midisport remote in your spotlight. it's a GREAT patchbay.

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 6:40 pm
by winningatlife
pflosi wrote:your midisport 8x8 can work without computer. search for midisport remote in your spotlight. it's a GREAT patchbay.
Only problem is it isn't being recognized at all by the computer (or any computer for that matter). I'm getting some new firmware chips sent to me by M-Audio hopefully this fixes the problem. :|

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 6:51 pm
by pflosi
that's rather strange. i guess u know that u have to be in usb mode...

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 10:40 pm
by winningatlife
pflosi wrote:that's rather strange. i guess u know that u have to be in usb mode...
Yeah definitely. It seems to have a deeper issue... all of the lights are flashing as soon as a USB cable is plugged into the back of the device (whether or not the other end is plugged into a computer or not). I tried the 'hard reset' a few times,M-Audio tech support is going to send me some chips I guess.

I'll give it a shot and then buy a MOTU if it doesn't work.

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 11:44 pm
by pflosi
have you tested another usb cable?

Re: MIDI Patch Bays and SYSEX Messages in OS X?

Posted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 1:53 am
by aredj
Just to sell the Motu a little here (I've not used an maudio patcher)...

The routing is super handy... 'in midi 2 - out midi 4 6 8 9..' or whatever...
Mutes for any type of data ... re-routing channels - 'in midi 5 channel 11 --> out midi 8 channel 4'

All this can be set from the front panel stand alone... its totally solid.