Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

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Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by logix » Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:08 pm

Realizing I don't have the physical room for all of my synth hardware I'm considering downsizing (i.e. dumping stuff).
The question is: what is no worth keeping any more, what can I replace with the other gear I already have and what can be replaced with software synths?

I'm an old school guy who started playing in the late 80s, so I'm all into MIDI sequencing, hardware synths, drum machines and samplers -and with no recording gear; doing it all in one take (and recording it to a casette deck).
Of course with DAWs everything has changed (I no longer need to play everything in one take), but I'm still struggling to figure out where to start with all that. With so much gear I'm going to run everything into a 48-input line mixer, then repatch when recording into the DAW. I have some cheapo hardware effects (Alesis Quadraverb 2, Behringer virtualizer, ART SGE Mach II), but think I might use those just for composing (in hardware), then add (better quality) software effects to the tracks when recording. So that's my setup. Now for the gear I'm considering selling:

Yamaha TX-81z
I know this is a "classic", but do I really need it when I already have a DX-7 (1st. generation and a TX-802 which so far are keepers)? I know it's got different waveforms, so in case it's irreplaceable, what kind of sounds exactly are unique to it? I've always seen it as a cheap alternative to a DX-7, not something totally unique.

Roland D-110
How does this synth stand today? It's not quite a D-50, and there are loads of software instrument ROMplers out there. And multi-timbrality isn't as necessary now as it was back in the day. Would you keep it?

Roland JX-8P
Am I crazy for considering to get rid of this? :o
I have to add that I have an MKS-70 (which I want to keep) as well as the programmer for it (I suppose most of the programming can be done with an iPad or computer editor these days, but real knobs are still something else).
I haven't yet had time to really get to know the MKS-70 inside and out, and my first impression is that the JX-8P is more "instant" at programming while the MKS-70 is a little more cumbersome, but that might just be because I haven't read the manual properly or gotten the hang of it.

Yamaha DX-7 (1st generation)
Sure it's cool to have the original DX-7, and I do love its keyboard (it's nice as a master controller despite velocity only going up to 100 and not 127), but I do have a TX-802. On the other hand, if I sell the JX-8P I will need a master keyboard and if I do buy the keyboard-synth of my dreams (Sequential Prophet 6) it'll be nice to have a 5-octave keyboard....

Roland MKS-50
I'm really unsure about this one. I haven't used it much so I'm not quite sure firsthand what it's capable of but I understand it's a bread 'n butter type analog synth good for just about everything within the warm, analog territory. In the category of the popular Juno 6, 60, 106 synths. Is it really that unique, or do I already have what it can do in the MKS-70, and for bass: my Studio Electronics SE-1 (which I bought to replace my Minimoog)?

Roland SH-101
Again, am I crazy for thinking about letting it go? Maybe... it is a very versatile synth with its built-in sequencer (great for syncing to my TR-808), arpeggiator and "instant" satisfaction with its sliders and knobs, but is it really so unique that I need it?
If I get an SCI Prophet 6, could that replace it (and more)?

Yamaha TX-16W
I know people no longer mess around with 3.5" floppy disks these days (but those can be replaced with floppy disk emulators). Apart from that I understand that the playback technique is completely different in software samplers or even more modern hardware samplers, and I might be saying goodbye to something unique and better sounding. True or not?

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by madtheory » Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:39 pm

Well, you asked for opinions... here's my tuppence worth! :lol:

Yeesh! Keep the SH-101. Seems to me you like it. Plus it does a thing nothing else does. The SCI will not replace it.

I would be inclined to get rid of the JX3P and the MKS50, because the MKS70 is the ultimate version of all of those. Especially since you have the programmer for it. Good news is those Rolands are worth decent money (because they're very nice). I'm assuming you like the Roland thing. This is probably sacreligious to some, but IMHO the MKS70 (or MKS80) is what a Juno 60 would be if it was a real synth. Both can totally do sonically what a Juno does, but maybe people need to use their brains a little more to get the sweet spots.

The TX16W is a nice sounding thing, super easy to use with the Typhoon OS. But speaking as a long term heavy user, the Cyclone plugin emulation is identical. These days I only use that to get my old library out into CMIV, which is much funkier sounding, and has more range for messed up but lovely aliasing. The TX16W is quite a bit more hifi sounding. But... it's not worth a lot of money.

The D-110. It's not a D-50, not by a long shot. It's a terrible synth compared to that. Well actually I think it's just a terrible synth. But... it's not worth much.

The DX7 I like, because of the envelope bug. TX802, not so much. No bug. But it is nice and clean sounding, and it has layering within. The other little TX is kind of a classic, and is easy to get into, but it's a bit too much FM you have there I think? And you can sell the TX for a good price, because they're nice. Actually, layering your FM synths with the MKS70 will get you some lovely sounds.

The desk is a nice way to work when you have the space. I got rid of mine for a patchbay, don't regret it. It's tidier and makes it easier to make chains of the outboard. I have a Quadraverb+, I like the resonator on it. Does the Qaudraverb 2 have that?

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by desmond » Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:42 pm

Given what you want to get rid of, and bearing in mind what you already have to substitute - I'd get rid of it *all*, and use that money to get something different and inspirational, unless there was some specific reason for keeping something.

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by logix » Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:52 pm

Desmond: very good point indeed!
I'm still a stranger to the softsynth/DAW thing, and have to admit that in the back of my mind those solutions are still prone to timing issues compared to hardware MIDI gear and hardware MIDI sequencers (or an Atari ST running whatever MIDI sequencer). I don't know if that's still a fact but ...if it works don't fix it as the saying goes ;)

Were you suggesting to get rid of ALL the hardware gear I have and replace it with softsynths/soft-samplers within a DAW environment, or get rid of all the gear I considered, then replace it with less, but more inspirational gear (or software -whatever works)?

madtheory wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:39 pm
Well, you asked for opinions... here's my tuppence worth! :lol:
And much appreciated! It's given me some food for thought.

SH-101:
Yes, the SH-101 is a nice little synth. Looks like a toy though :D
I take it that whatever Behringer has cloned it must be for a reason, and hopefully not just the hype.

JX-8P vs. MKS-70: it would probably make sense to learn the MKS-70 properly, then when I find out how to use it in the same way as the JX-8P (very quick to program/edit on the fly, save and use new sounds -even record the slider movements via MIDI which is great for say opening/closing the filter in realtime), then sell it and keep the MKS-70 (which can be twice as fat with the layering)
....but what to do with the PG-800 programmer? I know these go for a fair bit these days, and would probably make the JX-8P sale more attractive as a complete package.
A question/idea has come up recently: I have an old iPad Mini which could probably be used as a programmer for multiple synths instead of just the MKS-70 (and this would also save a lot of room compared to all the various programmers), but I'd like to hear from people who have used both (iPad and "real" hardware Roland programmers) -is the real thing better, or will the iPad work just as well (I assume after an adjustment period)? And once sysex has been dumped over to the iPad -how do you back it all up on a computer (a Mac in my case) and how do you transfer sysex data from the Mac (i.e. patches received from others/downloaded from various sites) over to the iPad?

TX-16W:
I agree -I've always found it sounding very nice. I did manage to download and try out the free release of Typhoon, but following that had my gear put in storage and thus never really got to learn and use it.
So Cyclone with a DAW appears similar? Are the sync-issues (i.e. drums getting out of sync with the rest of the track) still an issue, or do you find it fully replacing the sampler?

CMIV? You're referring to the Arturia CMI-V (Fairlight CMI) soft-sampler, right?
Sounds interesting. Like most people I've never seen or tried a real Fairlight so that would be nice to try out.

D-110:
Yes, I've had the same thoughts. I have read postings where people say it's a fantastic synth which can do much more than what most presets show it can, but then again that takes a lot of time, and..... I'd rather make music.
And won't many soft-synths be able to do those breathy and "sample-attack + synth" type sounds today without any problem? It only takes up 1U rack space, but everything counts...
Too bad it's not worth much, but I also have the Roland programmer for it which should make it easier to sell and pull up the price a bit I hope.

DX-7 vs. TX-802 vs. TX-81z:
Please explain what you mean by "the envelope bug". Are you referring to the keyboard velocity only going up to 100 instead of the MIDI standard of 127?

Yes, I think you're right about having a bit too much FM in there. The thing is that the DX-7 is a nice MIDI keyboard, and if I sell the JX-8P I still need a master keyboard. Then again I could sell them both, get an SCI Prophet 6 (or for less gear hoarding: not buy it!), and instead get a more up to date MIDI keyboard controller with 61 keys (a few years ago I considered getting an Akai MPK-61, Roland A-800 or Yamaha KX-61, but it all depends if it's worth it and compared to how much I can sell the DX-7 for.
People discuss the "gritty" sound in the original DX-7 which they say makes it more interesting, warm or funky, but having compared the same sounds in both synths (DX-7 Mk 1 vs. TX-802) I honestly couldn't hear any difference at all. Maybe there's something wrong with my ears, or maybe people are defending their investments with those comments. I have no idea, but would like to know before parting with something I could regret not being able to ever get back.

The TX-81z they say is good for video game type sounds because of it's aliasing, which is interesting because I do want to try to recreate some of those 80s arcade type sounds. Then again the "feel" of those type sounds might have more to do with the clever sequencing than the actual sound generation. Hmm... not sure what to do with that, and if this synth is worth keeping.

Mixer:
You say you got rid of the mixer for a patchbay, but I'm planning to keep the mixer AND patchbay, because how would I else manage to connect together all the synths?
I only have 8 inputs in the Focusrite 18i20 audio interface, so that would mean I'd have to choose a couple of synths, then record those, re-patch and record some other gear etc. My idea is to compose with all of my gear available via audio and MIDI, then do the re-patching as I do a proper recording: 8 tracks at a time.
Or maybe I've missed the point all together and you're mainly using soft-synths so you don't need a mixer? Please explain how you've set things up. I could probably learn a thing or too (as I'm in the planning stage of setting up a home studio).

Quadraverb 2: I'm not sure what effects it has compared to the Quadraverb+, but it'll probably do for adding a little reverb/delay while composing. I hear effects are generally much better done with DAW plugins these days (unless you have expensive classics from EMS, Lexicon etc. which I don't!) so it's probably pointless to buy more hardware effect processors, at least the affordable ones.

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by desmond » Thu Mar 12, 2020 1:18 am

logix wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:52 pm
I'm still a stranger to the softsynth/DAW thing, and have to admit that in the back of my mind those solutions are still prone to timing issues compared to hardware MIDI gear and hardware MIDI sequencers (or an Atari ST running whatever MIDI sequencer). I don't know if that's still a fact but ...if it works don't fix it as the saying goes ;)
Softsynths are *sample* accurate. MIDI is way worse than that (it takes about 3ms to send a note-on message - I'll leave you to work out how many samples out of time a three-note MIDI chord would be ;) ). Timing is *way* better in the box...
logix wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:52 pm
Were you suggesting to get rid of ALL the hardware gear I have and replace it with softsynths/soft-samplers within a DAW environment, or get rid of all the gear I considered, then replace it with less, but more inspirational gear (or software -whatever works)?
No, just the stuff you were suggesting. I mean, you've got a lot of duplication - eg A DX7, a TX81Z, a TX802. Unless you want to keep the master keyboard, I'd keep the 802, and lose the others. The same goes for the JX8P/MKS70. You only need one, dependent on the preferred form factor (and the MKS70 is more powerful than the 8P anyway).

Yes, you can find software equivalents of these, but I don't think that's the point of this post, and anyway, you can still do the software thing alongside your hardware, it's not either/or.

The TX sampler is a pain in the bum to use, and is easily replaced by software samplers that are easy to use, don't have memory contraints and loadl/save their samples along with your projects.

The D110 is a cheap budget multitimbral module, useful as a cheap way of expanding MIDI voices back in the day. It doesn't sound great, or is easy to use, and is no patch on the D50. Really, those cheap sound modules are pretty poor by today's standards, which is why I'd lose it too (although you won't get much money for it, and if you still use it, it doesn't take up much space...)

As for the 101 - I'm not really a fan, it was always a budget, simple synth, but for some EDM genres it seems to be worshipped, and sells for much more money than it's musically worth imo. You could always sell it for a decent price, and replace it with the Behringer 101 or whatever if you really loved the 101 thing, and still have enough money left over for another synth...

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by ppg_wavecomputer » Thu Mar 12, 2020 8:26 am

Keep the keyboard-based instruments and sell off the 19" rackmounts. Personally, I think they are terrible-sounding stuff, and some of them are a PITA to program. Not worth the bother IMHO.

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by logix » Thu Mar 12, 2020 12:20 pm

desmond wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 1:18 am
logix wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:52 pm
I'm still a stranger to the softsynth/DAW thing, and have to admit that in the back of my mind those solutions are still prone to timing issues compared to hardware MIDI gear
Softsynths are *sample* accurate. MIDI is way worse than that (it takes about 3ms to send a note-on message - I'll leave you to work out how many samples out of time a three-note MIDI chord would be ;) ). Timing is *way* better in the box...
Wow!
This is really mind blowing to me, and I should probably give this whole "in the box" thing another serious look.
If soft-samplers are much easier and quicker to use (remember the term "disk jockey" from back in the 90s when everybody spent forever shuffling 3.5" floppy disks before they could even start thinking about making music?), sound as good as their hardware equivalents and don't add timing issues I need to give this a second consideration and not be stuck in the past.
With so much gear taking up so much space (and it's all just a hobby) the rest of the family have started raising their voices, understandably ;) so it should be a no-brainer :)
Are there any downsides today with "in the box" (ITB) solutions compared to the 80s/90s way of hardware synths/samplers? Being stuck in the past I'm sure, I still have this voice in my head saying that MIDI ITB is useless compared to hardware MIDI sequencing (or an Atari ST -which I also have by the way)?
I'm invisioning noticeable glitches with sequenced beats such as what I've heard with my Roland D-110 and other multi-timbral synths. Not good at all!


I agree about the gear duplication (multiple FM synths, JX-8P/MKS-70) which I seriously need to look into. The MKS-70 and TX-802 are more or less keepers in my book. The others, so-so.
Yes, you can find software equivalents of these, but I don't think that's the point of this post, and anyway, you can still do the software thing alongside your hardware, it's not either/or.
Actually, all of this has given me an idea: I think I'll set up my hardware studio as first intended, which will give me a chance to actually get re-acquainted with the gear. Simultaneously I want to learn how to use a DAW and all the benefits it has.

The TX sampler is a pain in the bum to use, and is easily replaced by software samplers that are easy to use, don't have memory contraints and loadl/save their samples along with your projects.
The confusing thing is why a couple of plugin variants of the TX-16W have been made if it's not really that special. I could never afford the 16-bit Akai S-1000, and got a good deal on the TX. In my opinion it's always sounded very close to the original material I've sampled (with one exception: the TR-808 bass drum which brought in a lot of noise).
Other than that it's been a royal pain to use like you say, though Typhoon should make that better. But you still have low-capacity floppies (or floppy disk images in case of a floppy emulator) and limited memory (though I recently got hold of a 6 MB third party expansion board on eBay).
Good points though, and something to seriously consider doing away with.

The D110 is a cheap budget multitimbral module, useful as a cheap way of expanding MIDI voices back in the day. It doesn't sound great, or is easy to use, and is no patch on the D50. Really, those cheap sound modules are pretty poor by today's standards, which is why I'd lose it too (although you won't get much money for it, and if you still use it, it doesn't take up much space...)
That's what I was hoping to hear! Honestly, having old gear which can be hard to replace in case you regret selling it is no fun, but NOT selling stuff and hoarding just because of ignorance to its usefulness is just as bad.
Back in the day I found it very nice to have a full drumset available immediately (no loading floppies into the sampler), but as far as I remember you'd get very bad and higly noticeable delays with busy beats (i.e. a 1/16th hihat along with the drums) which was useless. I suppose with a DAW you can easily set up a standard "bread & butter" template to auto-load, just so you can start composing right away?

As for the 101 - I'm not really a fan, it was always a budget, simple synth, but for some EDM genres it seems to be worshipped, and sells for much more money than it's musically worth imo. You could always sell it for a decent price, and replace it with the Behringer 101 or whatever if you really loved the 101 thing, and still have enough money left over for another synth...
True! Again, good points.
I think the true test is to see if I really start actually using it again. Keeping stuff because of its collector value or "coolness" doesn't count :lol:

So, that's all very good points and I appreciate your feedback very much. Keep 'em coming if there are more things to be said about this.

OK, having opened up my mind with the ITB thing one big question comes up: which DAW should I consider? I know that learning curves are steep, so I want to avoid trying out a dozen before settling on something usable.
Here's my wishlist:

Runs on a Mac (2010 Mac Pro with OSX 10.11, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20)
Not overly complicated
Works first and foremost as a multi-track recorder, with effects and EQ to easily be added
MIDI sync to external sequencers (built-in MIDI sequencing would also be beneficial, and for all I know (if it works properly) might in time replace my needs for an external sequencer)

As a Mac user I already have Garageband (10.2) of course, which I've played around with and is nice, but it won't sync to anything which leaves out the possibility of multi-track recording with anything sequenced (I'm sure they want people to buy Logic Pro for that).

I also have Ableton Live Lite 10 (bundled with my audio interface). I think it has track limitations and such, but will probably be a good start if I upgrade to the full package.
Then there's Bitwig Studio 2.4 which came free with a music magazine (Computer music) about a year ago.
I also received free licenses (through some magazine or a hardware bundle perhaps) for Tracktion Waveform 10 and Tracktion T7 free. I also received a free license for Presonus Studio One 3 some years ago from somewhere (fully legal licenses for all of these in case anyone's wondering).

Apart from Garageband they're all a bit overwhelming, and given that they all demand that I invest a fair bit of time to learn -are any of these worthwhile for what I'm after or should I look elsewhere?
Last edited by logix on Thu Mar 12, 2020 12:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by logix » Thu Mar 12, 2020 12:22 pm

ppg_wavecomputer wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 8:26 am
Keep the keyboard-based instruments and sell off the 19" rackmounts. Personally, I think they are terrible-sounding stuff, and some of them are a PITA to program. Not worth the bother IMHO.
I agree that a lot of them are hard to program, but what do you compare them with when you say they sound terrible?
What would you suggest I replace them with?

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by madtheory » Thu Mar 12, 2020 3:00 pm

For a hobby, and family harmony, I would sell all that stuff. That's a lot of cash for a powerful computer and suite of great plugins, nice speakers, acoustic treatment, etc. etc. and a holiday :) I mean, you've an 808, a 101, and an MKS70. Big money.
logix wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:52 pm
Yes, the SH-101 is a nice little synth. Looks like a toy though :D
SH-101: Agreed. IMO because it's cute simple to use, it's more expensive than it should be. It can do great bass, but I can imitate on a Novation KSR using the Drift parameter (emulates analogue drift) and the bottom end is actually bigger on that.

Converting to software: I'm entirely ITB. Arturia V collections gives me a DX7 with the envelope bug and the TX81z waveforms, a Roland Jupiter 8 which sounds better than an MKS70 or a Juno, and CMIV which is a far more characterful sampler than a TX16W, and a helluva lot less hassle to use than a Mirage or an FZ-1, or an Akai S1000.

I use the Novation KSR as the controller for each of the Arturia synths.
Image
It's fast, intuituve, fun and productive. There are other devices that can do the same job.

Yamaha TX16W: There is only one actual emulation of the TX16W, and that's Cyclone, make by the people who developed Typhoon. It's really a nostalgia exercise "because the could". To answer your question, in my opinion yes it does fully replace the sampler. I sold the real one. The caveat is that I also felt I had used the thing to the full extent of its possibilities, so I didn't need it any more. This plug lets me access my old library in a very convenient way. I put those sounds into Kontakt or CMIV.

The plugin known as TX16W is nothing like a TX16W, although it can read Yamaha format samples (but not Typhoon format). The TX does kinda nice aliasing, but it's very limited for that effect compared to CMIV.

Yamaha DX7: Your mark 1 will not sound the same as your TX802 if you sysex in the same patches. Mainly with sustained percussive or plucky stuff. There's a wierd unpredictable interaction. They fixed it in the mark 2/ TX802. You can prove it for yourself with these Brian Eno patches:
https://www.factmag.com/2017/05/12/bria ... h-patches/

People discuss the "gritty" sound in the original DX-7 which they say makes it more interesting, warm or funky, but having compared the same sounds in both synths (DX-7 Mk 1 vs. TX-802) I honestly couldn't hear any difference at all. Maybe there's something wrong with my ears, or maybe people are defending their investments with those comments.

Your ears are right :) People think that DACs cause big differences in samplers and digital synths. But actually the wavetable encoding and trasnposing methods, etc. etc. create vastly bigger differences. Also, as I said earlier, with some patches there will be a difference due to the envelope bug.

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by ppg_wavecomputer » Thu Mar 12, 2020 3:50 pm

logix wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 12:22 pm
ppg_wavecomputer wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 8:26 am
Keep the keyboard-based instruments and sell off the 19" rackmounts. Personally, I think they are terrible-sounding stuff, and some of them are a PITA to program. Not worth the bother IMHO.
I agree that a lot of them are hard to program, but what do you compare them with when you say they sound terrible? What would you suggest I replace them with?
I compare them with themselves.

TX81Z? Tinny -- you have already got a DX-7 so why would you want to have a TX81Z around which was aimed at people who were not able to afford a real DX-7 at that time?

Roland D-110 sounds terrible to me as well -- I am biased against early ROMplers in general, and the D-series by Roland in particular. Always hated their overused saccharine-type sound. If it needs to be a D-series synth, settle for a D-550 (same thing here as with the TX81Z: The D-110 was aimed at people who did not have the money to buy the D-50/550).

Yamaha TX-16W? The most horrid sampler in the universe -- even a Prophet 2002 is less painful to program (and boy, this is one PITA as well… but it sounds fantastic, which the TX doesn't IMO).

Roland MKS-50 is nice but bread-and-butter, and it's essentially useless without a programmer (the JX-3P is a lot less painful to tweak, even without the programmer). Sell it and buy a JX in nice shape instead.

That's only my POV, of course.

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by desmond » Thu Mar 12, 2020 4:05 pm

logix wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 12:20 pm
Are there any downsides today with "in the box" (ITB) solutions compared to the 80s/90s way of hardware synths/samplers?
Well, some people like a room full of gear. When I was a kid, I used to doodle my dream studios, and they were pretty much wall to wall synths, sequencers, samplers, mixers etc. My dream studio of today is more about a nice environment, some choice pieces of hardware and instruments, and a powerful realisation platform (ie DAW system).
logix wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 12:20 pm
Being stuck in the past I'm sure, I still have this voice in my head saying that MIDI ITB is useless compared to hardware MIDI sequencing (or an Atari ST -which I also have by the way)?
I don't know where that come from. With Logic on OSX, as far as MIDI timing goes, best case (it depends on a few things like your MIDI interface etc) it's about the same as the venerable Atari ST timing, which is widely regarded as the best MIDI sequencer timing out there. Plus you have multiple MIDI ports, which was limited on the Atari, so unlike the ST, you can get that tight MIDI timing across 8, 20, 64 ports...
logix wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 12:20 pm
I'm invisioning noticeable glitches with sequenced beats such as what I've heard with my Roland D-110 and other multi-timbral synths. Not good at all!
Whatever you sequence on, it doesn't change the fact that some MIDI hardware just isn't quick to respond to incoming MIDI, with delays and jitter way worse than the theoretical best cases of MIDI. Some devices also get slower the more you ask them to do (multitimbral parts, lots of CC data etc). Of course, the beauty of the DAW is you can just solo those slower parts to get a best case, and print them to audio and re-align them if necessary. Plus it frees up the hardware for new parts...
logix wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 12:20 pm
The confusing thing is why a couple of plugin variants of the TX-16W have been made if it's not really that special.
There is loads of gear that isn't really that special, but people have all kinds of love for it for all kinds of reasons. Humans, amiright? ;)
logix wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 12:20 pm
Back in the day I found it very nice to have a full drumset available immediately (no loading floppies into the sampler), but as far as I remember you'd get very bad and higly noticeable delays with busy beats (i.e. a 1/16th hihat along with the drums) which was useless. I suppose with a DAW you can easily set up a standard "bread & butter" template to auto-load, just so you can start composing right away?
Sure. And, you know, sample accurate beats etc... :)
logix wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 12:20 pm
OK, having opened up my mind with the ITB thing one big question comes up: which DAW should I consider?
That's up to you. I'm a Logic guy, and that comes with a *huge* amount of plugins, instruments, samplers, and sample content. It also operates in more or less Garageband mode to begin with, until you start to turn on the Advanced Tools, so if you're familiar with GB, and want a few software instruments and a sampler to start you off, it's recommended.

It seems you have a bunch of software already - I suggest spending a few evenings in each, setting up a simple template with a few instruments and MIDI hardware sequencing, and make a little bit of music with them. See what works for you - some (like Live) have rather different workflows which you'll either like or not. See it as an opportunity to explore what's out there and see what's the best fit for you...

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by madtheory » Thu Mar 12, 2020 8:01 pm

I think desmond makes excellent points :) I can only add that I personally find a DAW with soft synths to be very productive. I have a small amount of outboard that is fun, but honestly doesn't get used half as much as the software.
ppg_wavecomputer wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 8:26 am
Keep the keyboard-based instruments and sell off the 19" rackmounts. Personally, I think they are terrible-sounding stuff, and some of them are a PITA to program. Not worth the bother IMHO
I'd suggest avoiding sweeping statements, they are not helpful. And maybe, read all of the gear list as well. An MKS-70 and a TX-802 are the opposite of terrible sounding. How can you approve of a DX-7 and not a TX-802?

And yes the TX16W with Yamaha OS is horrifically bad to work with. In contrast, a TX16W with the freely available Typhoon OS (which the OP already mentioned he tried briefly) is probably one of the easiest samplers ever. Very sensible hierarchy on it. And name another device that can auto-tune, auto-loop and auto-map whatever you sample into it?

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by ppg_wavecomputer » Fri Mar 13, 2020 12:24 am

madtheory wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 8:01 pm
[...] How can you approve of a DX-7 and not a TX-802? […]
There is no mention of a TX-802 as the candidate-to-leave in the original post, only a TX81Z -- which I referred to as tinny-sounding and not worth having. I don't approve of the DX-7 (or TX-802, for that matter) either, but they have got a lot more going for them and sound better to my ears (if only slightly). The original poster stated about the TX81Z, "I've always seen it as a cheap alternative to a DX-7, not something totally unique." If it isn't totally unique, why keep it then?

The question posed for the D-110 was "would you keep it?", to which my response was "no, I wouldn't because…" -- I never discussed the MKS-70 as this never was subject of a possible sale or trade, only the MKS-50. And my response was solely based on the original post and the instruments in question.

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by madtheory » Fri Mar 13, 2020 6:08 am

I can see see now logix got you to clarify your first post. I missed it. Makes sense.

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Re: Downsizing (which synths can I sell?)

Post by princefan3 » Fri Mar 13, 2020 7:42 am

You need the space thing....and you need to make money for some new....it's also best if you can create music when you have the inspiration and not get bogged down in menus.

I would....rid JX8P they are fricking huge and the programmer as you would get better sale value. I felt it was a slow keyboard anyway.

I would...rid the D110 they're cheap for a reason....also the TX81z as yes a poor mans DX7 type synth.

You need a master keyboard and I would keep the DX7 threrefore...keep the TX802 if it's quick to programme...if it's not then rid.

I would...rid the SH 101 for some more space and free up some finances for the new DAW....you will be able to do SH inside the box anyway.

I would....rid the MKS for a new PRO 6

I would... keep the sampler as they do need time spent with them and it sounds like there is a good option there with a bit of software linked to it.

You need speed, you have new, you have classic keyboard, you have space, you have some funds.

What's not too like.

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