How do you use synths to make music that is fresh?

tom Cadillac · Post by **tom Cadillac** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 7:55 pm

Well I wish this was automatic for synth players - as after all synths are new instruments. but it strikes me its hard to make music that is in any way new. maybe for some people they can't get enough 80s synth pop? But I wondered how others used their synths to try and make music that feels new/something they haven't heard before. And is it possible anyway. Or are even synths too limited a tool?

micahjonhughes · Post by **micahjonhughes** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 8:18 pm

I can't say that a synth is a limited tool! It is so much more flexible than all instruments used in the past. Guitars are pretty much the same now as in the 1950s but the music played on them today is only vaguely reminiscent of that era. Sure it is easiest to emulate classic pads, basses and leads on many synths both new and old, but that does not mean that you need to make those patches or even use the synth in same way it was used before. Maybe your conceptual block is not with synths but your concept of music. Expand your notions of what sounds acceptable and you will find new sounds to make on your synths and music that has never been heard.

kogmachine · Post by **kogmachine** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 8:27 pm

micahjonhughes wrote:I can't say that a synth is a limited tool! It is so much more flexible than all instruments used in the past. Guitars are pretty much the same now as in the 1950s but the music played on them today is only vaguely reminiscent of that era. Sure it is easiest to emulate classic pads, basses and leads on many synths both new and old, but that does not mean that you need to make those patches or even use the synth in same way it was used before. Maybe your conceptual block is not with synths but your concept of music. Expand your notions of what sounds acceptable and you will find new sounds to make on your synths and music that has never been heard.

Agreed! Many of the best synth sounds are made by accident. I'm fortunate not to have had any musical training. Everything I know I've learned on my own, and while I can't do a very good job covering songs that have already been made, I can make songs that are unique and fresh. It's still hard to come up with a new musical genre so try to fuse some genres and maybe you'll come up with somethng that satisfies you.

Post by **wiss** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 8:53 pm

music is only as fresh as the song writing, not sounds(well unless its unheard tones)

digitaljosh · Post by **digitaljosh** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:34 pm

Just layer sounds, samples, and effects like crazy till you come up with something new and cool!
The possibilities are endless with samplers and synths. We've blown way past the 80s.
Check out Aphex Twin, Mr. Oizo, Venetian Snares, Fatboy Slim, Luke Vibert, etc.

Windreaper · Post by **Windreaper** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:52 pm

wiss wrote:music is only as fresh as the song writing, not sounds(well unless its unheard tones)

+1

No amount of programming effort can overcome bad songwriting (and arranging), imo.

Post by **shaft9000** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 10:36 pm

keep 'em in the refrigerator w/ a slice of lemon peel....

BAH-DUM! pssssshhhhh...

really, though:

Just use your imagination. That's your own free wealth of ideas ya never knew you had, right there. Or get someone you can bounce ideas off and get a different perspective. go out for a walk.

here's one: do something else for a week or more, then come back to your synths when you are REALLY ITCHING to play them and chances are you'll be inspired and come up with something different and insteresting. Works for me every time.

In order to adequately create, one must 1st NOT create.

music is sprung from the tao

AstroDan · Post by **AstroDan** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:02 pm

I think every sound possibly generated from a oscillator, envelope and filter (i.e. a synthesizer) had been done a million times over - but composition of those sounds into new exciting arrangements has not yet been exhausted.

micahjonhughes · Post by **micahjonhughes** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:26 pm

I disagree. I think that purely sound wise there are new sonic possibilities within existing synths. Composition is important in making your music fresh but with electronic music the line between sound design and composition is not very clear. Music could consist of a synth droning. Is this sound design or composition?

Music*aL · Post by **Music*aL** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:50 pm

micahjonhughes wrote: Music could consist of a synth droning. Is this sound design or composition?

Neither. It's a synth droning!!!!

aL

oceanbourne · Post by **oceanbourne** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:55 pm

Most of my music is, in compositional terms, stemming from early (even middle ages) musical influences. It very rare that I use any sequencing, arps, or other form of evolving synth patterns in my music. In fact, were someone to come out with a synth that only had lead sounds and pads, I would be very content with that. I've never touched any of the bass sounds on any of my synths or samplers.

What I am trying to say here is as far as synths sounding "fresh", it comes down to how we use them: personally, I feel far too much emphasis is placed currently on the use of synths in dance music (though I do love dance music) and therefore evolving patterns and textures instead of the creation of synth sounds that, as polyphonic instrumental sounds can be applied as a solo performance instrument. Some pieces I've written treat the synth as a solo keyboard instrument much like a piano or clavichord would be treated and these pieces can be played by one person, live, in one sitting. Most of my friends who hear my work think pieces like this sound "new" because you simply don't hear much music like that for synths these days . . . even Wendy Carlos's ground-breaking work contained multiple tracks. I know most people on here will not have the same musical goals I have, but I think at least as a compositional excercise just sitting down and trying to write something that is consummate and can be played live in one sitting is a good thing to try.

jayman · Post by **jayman** » Sun Jul 15, 2007 3:48 am

for me the whole concept of getting into synths was based on being fresh. if it isn't i'm not doing it right

Huppo · Post by **Huppo** » Sun Jul 15, 2007 4:26 am

AstroDan wrote:I think every sound possibly generated from a oscillator, envelope and filter (i.e. a synthesizer) had been done a million times over - but composition of those sounds into new exciting arrangements has not yet been exhausted.

Can I sell you an imagination?

tom Cadillac · Post by **tom Cadillac** » Sun Jul 15, 2007 4:44 am

I like the idea of looking at compositional stucture and that this is where the core of fresh creativity is, rather than "lets make a funny new synth noise'.

Also I think synths can be brilliant solo instruments and that this really makes you value how expressive they can be played live.

Mmmm.... synths are so cool. How on earth does for instance a classical guitarist keep themselves interested/

tom Cadillac · Post by **tom Cadillac** » Sun Jul 15, 2007 5:42 am

I'v been thinking about this and am sort of answering my own question, though I'd be interested to here the details of how others are going about things......

Anyway 1) Start with writing lyrics and rhythm togather. This is the basic start of music for humanity - singing and banging things. This will focus the lyrics on the metre of language, the musical flow of written poetry, rather than the chaos of speech. And for beats trying to get away from, "lets switch on the drum machine" - so using interesting samples with sequencers. And maybe laying this down with some live percussion at the same time - the machine stuff can hold the beat.

2) Then get a synth sound that matches the mood of the words and playing quite percussively with chords. Then letting melody arise out of this and added this back to the singing.

3) Then using as much bass as possible. (I'v listened to too much Drum and bass to keep me alert while driving probbaly.)
Using an expressive instrument like a Korg Prophecy to make the bass sing and bounce rather than just a bass line repeated.And then maybe some lovely deep analogy sub-bass to resonante below.

So that sounds like a nice basic recipe to take into the studio and cook with.
Any other recipes?