In a Paris music store a few weeks ago...

[KBD_TRACKER]

This store sells a pretty good range of stuff (moog, elektron, DSI, doepfer, vermona, etc..)
Some of it with top shelf price.

I was looking at a TR8 (499 euros).
A salesman came to fix some wiring near me (btw in that store floor sales people are often practicing musicians).
I asked him how the TR8 was selling.
He said fine...

So then I asked him whether one should consider the TR8 a worthwhile substitute for a 2,000 euros TR808. He answered with surprisingly some affect in his voice: " Absolutely. That is, if one got any intellectual honesty".

What do you make of this answer ?? Do you agree ??

[knolan]

Absolutely - it is a worthwhile substitute; and at a keen price.


But if you're after the real thing (not just the sound, which is different) but the whole experience, then you need the original.


There is not one person alive who buys an emulation who would not like the original - IF they bought the emulation because that want the original.

No Arturia MiniMoogV will ever 'feel' like the original (it darn well sounds like it) and in like fashion, the TR8 will never feel like the TR808.


We're into the realm of human-feel and experience, not objective sound - so the TR808 is going to continue to sell for 2000 Euro because the TR8 does not deliver any of what the TR808 provide in those regards.


So yes - a good substitute!

[Vxster]

I guess his response is tempered by the fact that he is a salesperson. He wants to sell the units. I like the sound, I just wish there were more patterns and song mode/chaining.

[moremagic]

it definitely sounds nice, but the lack of individual outs makes a 707 look better to me
of course thats because i outboard everything all to h**l so aint much better on a drum machine than a lotta outs
if youre after a fat sound the tr 8 is real nice

[ppg_wavecomputer]

I am waiting for the first TR8'S to return to the used market to give them a try. I am curious how it will feel in terms of interaction -- that's what I like most about the 808. This, and the fact that it seems to be about the only drum machine to fit into my music (which is as far remote from dance music as can be).

Stephen

[Dr. Phibes]

What do you make of this answer ?? Do you agree ??

What do you make of it?

[griffin avid]

He answered with surprisingly some affect in his voice: " Absolutely. That is, if one got any intellectual honesty".

What do you make of this answer ?? Do you agree ??

Knolan already answered for ALL OF US.
If you want what the HARDWARE offers as in the EXACT HARDWARE, get that.
If you only want the sound, you have choices.

intellectual honesty...

Douchey phrase, to be sure. I assume this is probably coming from someone who never put any music out fully or shared his intellect through music. These are thoughts by 'people making music' towards other people making music.
People fall in to two camps
1) I know what the sound making machines in use are
2) I DON'T know what the sound making machines in use are.

If you know about TRs then you know how rare/expensive they are and how unlikely every "TR-sounding sound" you hear came from a live hardware unit as opposed to samples/emulations/approximations..etc...

If you don't know, then you don't care and all it is, is a nice sound in a lot of records you hear and might like.

intellectual honesty...

A ridiculous concept in the age of digital editing, composite takes, mastering, MP3s, unlimited access and sculpted online persona. And worse when your F'in drum machine is the bar.

[Bitexion]

It seems like he implies that "intellectual honesty" means staying "true" to the hardware medium and avoid that evil software..weird idea, when everything in a modern recording studio is usually digital. You record into a computer sequencer (cubase/logic/protools), tracks are edited and mastered digitally, and the output format is digital.

[Percivale]

Could the person had meant "if you are smart enough (intellectual), TR-8 sounds good enough for most practical purposes (honesty), i.e. no need to spend so much more?

[Hybrid88]

To be honest I think he sounds like a twat.

Intellectual honesty? What the f**k has that got to do with anything.

It's a bloody drum machine not world poverty. Either you care enough to get the real thing or as a musician you accept that the TR-8 is a very workable substitute.

[Stab Frenzy]

Anyone considered that the dude is French and the concept he's thinking of might not translate that well into English?

[edfunction]

Anyone considered that the dude is French and the concept he's thinking of might not translate that well into English?

This!

[corndogssg]

that's just what I was thinking! when I need to read up on a waldorf product or arturia, something is allways lost in translation whenever it gets converted into English from German or French. (just look at how bad some foreign movies are just because they "lost" everyone in their crappy translation. i watched a French movie the other day, it was a " beauty and the beast" movie that was very well shot but the English translation made it literally sound as if everyone was talking like master yoda, or in the 3rd person or in past tense. It ruined the film. hah. it had a good musical score though

[KBD_TRACKER]

What do you make of this answer ?? Do you agree ??

What do you make of it?

after reflection, i discount the "just buy it !" motivation. as i said the store is full of much much more expensive stuff. compared to it, the TR8 is peanuts price wise.

what i imagine is that the guy may (note: "may") have been tired at the legions of purists and existing TR808 owners hot and bothered by the idea that they may have needlessly spent 2 grands on a reproducible relic, dissing the newer TR8 because of this, because of that, etc..

just a guess.

[KBD_TRACKER]

Anyone considered that the dude is French and the concept he's thinking of might not translate that well into English?

This!

i know french people a bit. in music gear they tend to be very cartesian ... matter of fact, pragmatic. thus the concept of individual honesty (recognizing things as they are) vs being driven by "group mentality" (no disrespect intended !). but also look at users reviews for TR8 in http://fr.audiofanzine.com/bar/roland/tr-8/ (need to speak french though )
in fact even though the french are really uptight about quality, reliability, etc.. over there it seems that "brand fetishism" is less frequently a factor in gear buying than in the US.