First Analog Synth : Prophet 600?

[cybergrinder]

Hello all, new to the forum, but I've visited this site regularly looking up synths. Great site.

Anywho, I'm looking at getting my hands on my first analog synthesizer. My first synthesizer that I've been learning on for quite a while now is KORG MS2000b which I love playing. I like playing warm ambient sounds (Boards of Canada, Radiohead's electronic stuff etc) I've looked at the specs of several other analogs but was wondering what you all here think. The features/price that these things go for seems ideal for a first analog synth. There is one for sale on Craigslist in my area for $800, great condition, studio use only and the battery for memory was recently serviced. I was also looking at KORG Polysix but the ones I've seen are going for alot more and have issues.

I'm also looking at an Alesis ION for other projects ( industrial doom metal ) I've seen some for around $600 but the the MS2000 can actually pull it off at the moment and I would like to explore analog.

Thanks!

[Stab Frenzy]

Are you asking us for advice? If so go for it.

[Mush]

The p600 has c**p-slow envelopes. I would buy something else if i were you.

[Stab Frenzy]

'Warm ambient sounds' aren't something that needs fast envelopes IMO.

[madtheory]

The Korg is great. Check out the Novation KS also, seriously under rated.

[Mush]

'Warm ambient sounds' aren't something that needs fast envelopes IMO.

I always prefer synths that ain't limited in that way. I would say that the ion is offering him lots more for his money. The p600 i played last week was living up to every bad opinion i've read about it. Sure, for warm analog slow pads it is okay, but even an Electric piano type pad will be hard to get working.

[madtheory]

Yes I would think the P600 is too limited and a VA could certainly give the same or better tone.

[pricklyrobot]

Are you asking us for advice? If so go for it.

+1

I don't try to make percussive sounds with it, so I've never been bothered by the envelope speed. The other thing people like to complain about is stepping on the filter cut-off knob, but that's easily gotten around by using the Filter CV In (9V battery, passive volume pedal and you're good to go, and you have both hands free). Also, if you're still learning synthesis, there's nothing like a knob-per-function analog to help you wrap your head around the basics.

[SWAN]

Hello all, new to the forum, but I've visited this site regularly looking up synths. Great site.

Anywho, I'm looking at getting my hands on my first analog synthesizer. My first synthesizer that I've been learning on for quite a while now is KORG MS2000b which I love playing. I like playing warm ambient sounds (Boards of Canada, Radiohead's electronic stuff etc) I've looked at the specs of several other analogs but was wondering what you all here think. The features/price that these things go for seems ideal for a first analog synth. There is one for sale on Craigslist in my area for $800, great condition, studio use only and the battery for memory was recently serviced. I was also looking at KORG Polysix but the ones I've seen are going for alot more and have issues.

I'm also looking at an Alesis ION for other projects ( industrial doom metal ) I've seen some for around $600 but the the MS2000 can actually pull it off at the moment and I would like to explore analog.

Thanks!

Also consider Prophet 08. Reliability can be a problem with P600...also they are quite limited...

[pricklyrobot]

Reliability can be a problem with P600

They're not any more failure-prone than any other 20+ year-old synth, and considerably less so than some (Polysix with unchanged battery, Juno 106, etc.)

Granted, it could get expensive if you have to replace a bunch of the CEM chips, but I've only had one (VCA for the Poly-Mod section) c**p out on me in 4 years and managed to replace it for about $40 (cheers to http://www.vintageplanet.nl, who are also a cheaper source than Wine Country Sequential for the ver. 8 OS ROM). I think Technology Transplant/chipforbrains still has occasional batches of the replacement membrane panels for sale on Ebay (I bought one a while ago but haven't needed it, original panel is still going strong).

...also they are quite limited...

Compared to what? Any analog polysynths in this price range ($600-$800 lately), that I can think of, have roughly the same or less on offer, feature-wise. Granted the OP didn't explicitly state a budget, so I guess you're free to suggest whatever, but even a used P'08 rack is likely to cost considerably more than $800.

Also, for whatever it's worth, a good friend of mine sold his Prophet '08 in favor of a Prophet-600 based almost entirely on build quality. Something to consider if you're going to gig with it.

[SWAN]

Reliability can be a problem with P600

They're not any more failure-prone than any other 20+ year-old synth, and considerably less so than some (Polysix with unchanged battery, Juno 106, etc.)

Granted, it could get expensive if you have to replace a bunch of the CEM chips, but I've only had one (VCA for the Poly-Mod section) c**p out on me in 4 years and managed to replace it for about $40 (cheers to http://www.vintageplanet.nl, who are also a cheaper source than Wine Country Sequential for the ver. 8 OS ROM). I think Technology Transplant/chipforbrains still has occasional batches of the replacement membrane panels for sale on Ebay (I bought one a while ago but haven't needed it, original panel is still going strong).

...also they are quite limited...

Compared to what? Any analog polysynths in this price range ($600-$800 lately), that I can think of, have roughly the same or less on offer, feature-wise. Granted the OP didn't explicitly state a budget, so I guess you're free to suggest whatever, but even a used P'08 rack is likely to cost considerably more than $800.

Also, for whatever it's worth, a good friend of mine sold his Prophet '08 in favor of a Prophet-600 based almost entirely on build quality. Something to consider if you're going to gig with it.

I can see you have a P600 hence the impassioned response. However Ive also owned one and they can be temperamental with the membrane panel and slow 80s digital OS behaviour...also the keybed is more likely to misfire/be dirty, and the MIDI is slow if you are sequencing. Also, I felt the build was very cheap. P08 feels better to me...

Again, the P600 is limited compared to the Prophet 08 I suggested.

I wasnt comparing it to other vintage synths - that was the point of my post - to compare it to a Prophet 08. I think people generally tend to recommend more limited vintage synths automatically even when posters are not fussed about the vintage sound-and there are hassles and pitfalls to vintage synths only worth it if you like that tone. For first time analogue synth buyers the P08 makes a lot of sense.

Another to consider might be a Roland JX8p which does great strings and pads and IMO is a more solid/varied synth than the P600...but you need to get the programmer really...the PG800, or you could look at one of these: http://www.kiwitechnics.com/

Overall a P600 would be good for a raw basic sound but they are limited and build is low quality (Sequential cut as much cost as they could)....A P08 would be more reliable and varied as well as having lots of good presets to help learn synthesis...JX8p another decent to look at also but you need a programmer...my opinion anyways...

[pricklyrobot]

I can see you have a P600 hence the impassioned response. However Ive also owned one and they can be temperamental with the membrane panel and slow 80s digital OS behaviour...also the keybed is more likely to misfire/be dirty, and the MIDI is slow if you are sequencing. Also, I felt the build was very cheap. P08 feels better to me...

I don't know about impassioned (I like the P-600, but I don't want to marry it or anything ), I was just trying to elicit a more specific reason for you recommending against it (as I think it makes for a more useful thread all around). And hey, it worked! Thanks for a more detailed post.

I will say that the key contacts are pretty easily cleaned (it's time consuming sure, but not technically difficult). I don't have MIDI problems with it, but most of the sequencing I do is pretty basic, maybe it chokes on more complex/higher volume data? As far as the build quality: it's wood and metal, the keyboard is a little clackety and not the nicest to play but I don't feel like it's going to break on me, and the pots feel solid enough (considerably less wobbly than a lot of modern gear).

I should also say I got mine for $400 a few years ago, at which price it seemed like a no-brainer. At $800, I'd still say it's a solid option, but I might have a think about saving up a few hundred more for something more deluxe. All depends on what you're after I guess, raw sound vs. modulation options, smooth vs. gritty, et cetera, et cetera.

[GuyaGuy]

I'd say it's an awesome choice for a first synth if you can check it out for issues. All old gear can develop issues from time or mishandling--Moog, Prophet, whatever.

The tone is deep and dark with bite, the arpeggiator is good times, you have a huge number of presets for a synth of that time, and it offers lots of LFO options.

[pricklyrobot]

it offers lots of LFO options.

Hmm, don't know if I'd say "lots". It's just triangle or square wave routed to pitch, pulse width, and filter. That's pretty standard.

Although the Poly-Mod section does add the filter envelope and Osc B as modulation sources, with Osc A pitch and filter cut-off as destinations.

[GuyaGuy]

it offers lots of LFO options.

Hmm, don't know if I'd say "lots". It's just triangle or square wave routed to pitch, pulse width, and filter. That's pretty standard.

Although the Poly-Mod section does add the filter envelope and Osc B as modulation sources, with Osc A pitch and filter cut-off as destinations.

That's one more than the Juno 106! : )

But I guess I should have said "lots of modulation options"--especially for a poly at that price from that era.