Modular Moog

Entropy Farmer · Post by **Entropy Farmer** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 9:45 pm

gallant steve wrote:the most possible help is always the best option with a piece like this , but you do sound affronted at the idea that anyone who isn't an 100% paid up vintage synth specialist coud even have the right to use an instrument like this, Midiwall . A lot of care and expert attention it definitely needs, but that doesn't mean it's the preserve of vintage synth experts only for its *use* - its actually an * instrument * first and foremost, just one that needs a lot of expert care and knowledge to protect & keep running, and solid but not rare knowledge to understand functionally.

Nobody cares about him using it. Everyone cares about him not causing it to f**k explode. If he uses it as is before, at the very least, recapping the PSU, a nigh 40 year old capacitor could short and turn the entire machine into a fireball. This thing is literally a treasure and he can't even be bothered to clean a pot correctly.

midiwall · Post by **midiwall** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 11:29 pm

Entropy Farmer wrote:Nobody cares about him using it. Everyone cares about him not causing it to f**k explode. If he uses it as is before, at very least, recapping the PSU, a nigh 40 year old capacitor could short and turn the entire machine into a fireball. This thing is literally a treasure and he can't even be bothered to clean a pot correctly.

Spot on. That's exactly my point.

Use it all you want, I hope you learn all you can about this machine, it's an incredible piece. But if you don't go through it correctly, it'll be worth squat.

Mike; thank you. I see how what I wrote could have been read as me being "angry", but I was actually quite calm when writing it.

People, don't read it as me yelling or stuffing my finger in your face while saying it, I'm not confrontational - I _am_ passionate. Just read it as me _calmly_ asking a serious of questions to try to get my point across.

daddio; I wasn't the first person to get on his back. Even you got a small dig in over on the blog.

bhh, there are four or five people in this thread that are trying to tell you the right way to work through that thing. If you want to single me out as the bad guy, okay, have at it. Note though that NO ONE has popped up in this thread to say "yeup, I would have plugged it in right away too!". There are two sets of people in here... Those that are cheering for your find, and those that are trying to change your ways in order to preserve it.

We're trying to help... You're being stubborn.

Go back to the matrix blog and note my second post. I've been in your shoes and made the exact mistake that I'm trying to save you from.

Here're two pieces of help...

You need to get a scope onto the power supply. You need to see if there's any AC leaking on the rails. That's a sign of trouble coming.

Heed the warning about powering up circuits that have been dead for 40 years. Like rjd2, I've also seen bad things happen in circuits half that old.

badhatharry · Post by **badhatharry** » Sun Oct 14, 2007 3:19 am

Hey, MIDI, here's a blast from the past:

I disconnected the power supply from the unit before I turned it on, and metered the DC voltage, and then checked the AC ripple. The DC read 12v, 18v, and 24v, and the AC ripple was at 7mv.

So I have checked the amount of AC leaking into to power supply

That being said, I am recapping it next week, and it was on for part of one day. And it worked fine.

If you really bothered to listen to me before you started telling me how ignorant I am, our correspondence would have had a completely different tone. You continue to go on about how turning it on could blow it up, as do others. Mention it once, maybe twice to express your passion about it. Then, done. Note taken. Do not demand that I do everything you say because, once again, I didn't ask you about component level work on this device. You just came charging in here demanding that I obey your every command else I incur the wrath of the synth God. From the beginning, you simply assumed that I had no idea what I was doing. I admit, there were things I did not know. The crowbar protection was something I was not aware of, and I thank Peake for that. In fact, read the posts that Peake wrote. That is how you give advice to people. He made his suggestions, and was very nice about it. Now read your posts. That is how you get me to tell you to eat a d**k.

I don't know how many times I have to say that I didn't just move the thing out of storage, turn a hose on it and then fire it up. I have also mentioned that while the caps are stable, and the AC ripple is negligible, I have not tuned it on since the first day. I wanted to see what I was in for after I made sure the power supply would work. I am rebuilding the power supply next week before I turn it on again. This was the plan from the beginning. I appriciate those who suggested I recap the ps, but those who simply were pissed because they assumed I just turned it on with no examination, that kinda got to me. Then your post and the guy who thinks I need to apologize to my employers for the damage I have done so far made me angry.

And as far as the contact cleaner goes, yes, I am using DeoxIT, and if I have to replace a pot because the cleaner broke it, so what? I replace a pot. I'll honestly be surprised if I don't have to replace one, them being 38 years old and all.

But back to the point, Peake is an example of being helpful. You are an example of not being helpful. Either switch camps or stay out of it.

Post by **Jack Spider** » Sun Oct 14, 2007 1:18 pm

Okay, my warning was ignored - this is continuing to get heated. Any more and I'm locking the thread.

VSE is NOT a place to carry on arguments from other forums - signing up here as a member to carry on such disputes will NOT be tolerated and will result in a banning.

midiwall · Post by **midiwall** » Sun Oct 14, 2007 6:06 pm

Fine, I'll be the sacrificial lamb, I'm done.

Just remember... I'm not the only one that feels this way. And fwiw, I never made a demand of you, I'm confused as to why you keep saying that.

No matter.

Jack, I've been here for a while. I reg'd this moniker for continuity - phpBB doesn't let you switch.

michael stein · Post by **michael stein** » Mon Oct 15, 2007 7:15 am

"wrath of the synth God" - I just wanted to point out this potential name for a bad synth project.

minime123 · Post by **minime123** » Mon Oct 15, 2007 1:55 pm

not to bust your balls, but here are what are hopefully some thought provoking questions...

1. which form of deoxit are you using, and why?

2. also, how much do replacement moog modular pots cost?

mini

Post by **madtheory** » Mon Oct 15, 2007 6:56 pm

Oh c'mon! Pots are not an issue. Listen to the man- he's re capping the PSU. He appreciates the value of this instrument. He's enjoying it, as one should.

I suggest you make a lot of recordings of this instrument, because it is now notorious and highly marketable as sampler fodder

acmesoundlab · Post by **acmesoundlab** » Mon Oct 15, 2007 7:15 pm

I understand that everyone is concerned with the the health and preservation of this amazing Moog, but it seems a shame that the un-earthing of this great treasure did not result in a positive and celebratory conversation. Just my two cents. I really do understand everyones points, but this Moog needs positive encouragement to sing again.

Little Phatty music at http://hometown.aol.com/acmesoundlab/my ... index.html

Peake · Post by **Peake** » Mon Oct 15, 2007 9:08 pm

I don't have a component-level experience of the Moog, but since you're delving into the pots, there are a couple of items worth being aware of.

The filter uses, IIRC, AB Type J pots (inverse log?). If you have the oldest model 901b oscillators, you may find that they have wire-wound pots for the Frequency vernier.

I don't know if you can even clean wire-wound pots... But with the AB and others, it's been found that you can open the pots by prying back the metal tips and separating the bottom metal body, and accessing the resistive traces directly.

As always, there are more who know these things accurately and by heart and long experience. I can only help make you aware of what you may encounter.

Regards!

minime123 · Post by **minime123** » Mon Oct 15, 2007 10:45 pm

looks like someone wants to get banned!

Post by **Jack Spider** » Mon Oct 15, 2007 10:53 pm

Good job there's no incriminating posts to see, eh Slickie?

minime123 · Post by **minime123** » Mon Oct 15, 2007 10:57 pm

busted!

but are you really gonna ban him for that? seems a little harsh unless he has committed more severe crimes.

Post by **Jack Spider** » Mon Oct 15, 2007 11:00 pm

Nah, I just deleted the post - hardly banning material!

Post by **tallowwaters** » Tue Oct 16, 2007 2:47 am

jack, i am too lazy to read all of this, so feel free to pm the name of any wanker that needs whats comin to em, and i will be happy to oblige in the onslaught. after all, we cant everybody hating you.